Its not just moser/pwcc...more trimmers exposed

[Leon]

I get why you said it but number 7 is blasphemy. Just make sure the borders are big AND thick.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

My guiding rules. I feel like Satchel Paige lol.

1. Avoid sellers you don't trust.
2. Use VCP to make sure cards didn't originate with sellers you don't trust.
3. Don't buy cards that look short.
4. Don't buy cards if your first reaction is to question whether they're altered. Trust the unconscious reaction.
5. Don't buy high grade pre-war.
6. Past a certain value threshold, for 50s cards don't buy anything over a 7, and for 60s cards don't buy anything over an 8. And even there, consider 6s and 7s.
7. Don't pay huge premiums for perfect centering.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Leon

I get why you said it but number 7 is blasphemy. Just make sure the borders are big AND thick.

Oh, no doubt. But wouldn't you agree those cards are more likely to have been worked on?

[Leon]

Yes but I am not about to give up great looking, well centered vintage cards.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Oh, no doubt. But wouldn't you agree those cards are more likely to have been worked on?

[Peter_Spaeth]

As a general proposition card doctors cater to the market. When low pop commons were the thing, they were slicing the cards that were notoriously off center to make cards that would barely qualify as 8s. I strongly suspect that with the centering mania of the last couple of years, they are focused on finding cards they can make into perfectly centered ones.

[joshuanip]

My money (as I continue to buy) is that this will blow over. Known unknown risk for prewar, unknown risk for modern. Will this impact prices in short term, definitely. But medium (supply dries if prices take a hit) longer term (demand curve) supply and demand dynamics will prevail.

Not holding our breath that the culpable parties take a knee for the better of our industry. Economics are better for them to take a wait and see approach as soft short term prices are tolerable for them (not us) - unless they take this as an opportunity to innovate and take market share.

At minimum, the heightened awareness and ability to track cards (through the case) does make longer term profitability of cheating our hobby more risky. Which is a good thing. Can we have some FBI investigations in here! Will pile more dirt in our industry but definitely help longer term in placing punitive consequences for these criminals.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by joshuanip

My money (as I continue to buy) is that this will blow over. Known unknown risk for prewar, unknown risk for modern. Will this impact prices in short term, definitely. But medium (supply dries if prices take a hit) longer term (demand curve) supply and demand dynamics will prevail.

Not holding our breath that the culpable parties take a knee for the better of our industry. Economics are better for them to take a wait and see approach as soft short term prices are tolerable for them (not us) - unless they take this as an opportunity to innovate and take market share.

At minimum, the heightened awareness and ability to track cards (through the case) does make longer term profitability of cheating our hobby more risky. Which is a good thing. Can we have some FBI investigations in here! Will pile more dirt in our industry but definitely help longer term in placing punitive consequences for these criminals.

Moser & Brent have been doing this for at least 10 years and Hoser for 20. Nothing will be done, don't worry.

[drcy]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

As a general proposition card doctors cater to the market. When low pop commons were the thing, they were slicing the cards that were notoriously off center to make cards that would barely qualify as 8s. I strongly suspect that with the centering mania of the last couple of years, they are focused on finding cards they can make into perfectly centered ones.

Never understood the current centering mania. Centering is a quality, but not the quality.

[Tennis13]

Originally Posted by drcy

Never understood the current centering mania. Centering is a quality, but not the quality.

So there is one specific collector I know out there who is a big supporter of PWCC’s guy Brent who is also obsessed (I mean OBSESSED) with centering and has shown me some great cards over the years. I just hope 1). He isn’t one of the bad guys which has been my fear but now as i write this, 2) I hope he hasn't been scammed in large size through all this because I quite liked the guy when i met him at Nationals in the past few years. I have seen people snickering at him on other forums, so I am not too hopeful.

[benjulmag]

Originally Posted by drcy

Never understood the current centering mania. Centering is a quality, but not the quality.

+1

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Leon

Yes but I am not about to give up great looking, well centered vintage cards.

Just make sure they aren't centered 48 48.