Its not just moser/pwcc...more trimmers exposed

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by griffon512

"Someday, either a new grading company or an existing grading company will come out with a process to remove the humans from the grading process and use optical scanning and CMM tools to measure card size. They might provide this service as an upgraded service alongside human opinions which will be viewed as less reliable but perhaps ok for lower priced, lower grade commons as an authentication option."

Size among vintage cards should not be the sole determinant of whether a card is trimmed. There are many oversized vintage cards that are trimmed and many undersized vintage cards that are not trimmed versus a given set's standard size. Obviously an undersized card is more likely to be trimmed than a non-undersized card. The fact that all the statements above are true means that technology alone can not determine whether size was reduced post-production. That means that the likelihood a grading company will introduce a grading technology that will change many numerical grades to authentic based on size -- and presumably guarantee the loss in value of the card -- is extremely low. Common sense and anecdotal evidence reinforces that a large percentage of high grade pre-WWII cards are altered. That should not be a surprise to any knowledgeable person in the hobby. There will always be a cloud of uncertainty over the hobby, as is the case with most collectibles. It's up to each person how much they want to rely on faith versus certainty in what they buy. Until now -- and I don't see this changing much -- faith has trumped certainty.

+1

And it's my opinion that the trimmed cards are being stretched prior to trimming, so they're being trimmed down to what the card should actually measure. A computer or machine will never be able to distinguish the difference between a card that's been trimmed and one that hasn't based on the size of the card alone. It goes back to what I was saying just a couple posts above. People want to rely on someone or something else to do it for them because they're too damn laze to educate themselves. Sad really.

[LOUCARDFAN]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

+1

And it's my opinion that the trimmed cards are being stretched prior to trimming, so they're being trimmed down to what the card should actually measure. A computer or machine will never be able to distinguish the difference between a card that's been trimmed and one that hasn't based on the size of the card alone. It goes back to what I was saying just a couple posts above. People want to rely on someone or something else to do it for them because they're too damn laze to educate themselves. Sad really.

Yes, lots of people are uneducated these days when it comes to raw cards but this isn't the golden days where most card purchases were made where you could actually hold the card in your hand and examine it BEFORE buying it.

How many purchases has one made with the actual card in hand to examine before purchasing in the last 10-15 years? Probably, not many with the exception of the National and other shows.

Card grading was a great idea that was greatly needed with internet trading being what it has been for the last 20-25 years but then the greed took over and what could have been good thing for the hobby, just gave some a license to print money.

[doug.goodman]

Originally Posted by LOUCARDFAN

... but then the greed took over and what could have been good thing for the hobby, just gave some a license to print money.

THEN the greed took over?

Hahahahahahaha, I'm rolling on the floor laughing over here (and my hotel has hardwood floors, so it's a bit uncomfortable).

It was kind of early in the process when the greed took over...

Allow me to, once again, point out the very FIRST card that the biggest seller of opinions ever gave an opinion on (although it was pointed last time I mentioned it that they were probably giving that opinion for no charge)...

Ladies and gentleman, straight from being hand cut from a sheet, the first paid opinion that mattered, #00000001, I present to you the world's most valuable card, the authentic, oops, sorry, I mean 8 on a 10 scale, Gretzky Wagner...

[doug.goodman]

When a thread gets this long, sometimes it helps to post the same jokes.

And it IS a joke.

Doug "just call me the dead horse beater" Goodman

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by doug.goodman

When a thread gets this long, sometimes it helps to post the same jokes.

And it IS a joke.

Doug "just call me the dead horse beater" Goodman

The thread has to keep going otherwise this will get swept under the rug. Sometimes you have throw in a bad joke just to keep this thing going.

[doug.goodman]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

The thread has to keep going otherwise this will get swept under the rug. Sometimes you have throw in a bad joke just to keep this thing going.

They're actually good jokes, they have kept me laughing for years, ever since card #00000001 when everybody first stuck their head in the sand, trying to avoid the obvious.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by doug.goodman

THEN the greed took over?

Hahahahahahaha, I'm rolling on the floor laughing over here (and my hotel has hardwood floors, so it's a bit uncomfortable).

It was kind of early in the process when the greed took over...

Allow me to, once again, point out the very FIRST card that the biggest seller of opinions ever gave an opinion on (although it was pointed last time I mentioned it that they were probably giving that opinion for no charge)...

Ladies and gentleman, straight from being hand cut from a sheet, the first paid opinion that mattered, #00000001, I present to you the world's most valuable card, the authentic, oops, sorry, I mean 8 on a 10 scale, Gretzky Wagner...

And I would remind people that one of the most famous cards in our hobby - the 1933 Goudey Lajoie - was basically a scam pulled on collectors.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by doug.goodman

THEN the greed took over?





Ladies and gentleman, straight from being hand cut from a sheet, the first paid opinion that mattered, #00000001, I present to you the world's most valuable card, the authentic, oops, sorry, I mean 8 on a 10 scale, Gretzky Wagner...

Yep. I’ve been saying this for years.


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