"RESTORED" Wagner - how should we feel about this as collectors?

[Fred]

That's a pretty cool web page with the different Wagner's shown in pre-restoration and pre-slabbed states.

Is there a reason the McNall/Gretzky Wagner isn't shown side by side with the uncut panel and the slabbed card?

[oldjudge]

I think all of us would prefer an unrestored to a restored copy of a card. However, sometimes because of price or rarity this is impossible. In those cases I am fine with restored copies. The Wagner is nice looking and will sell for a fraction of what a similar appearing unrestored copy would sell for, bringing it into the availability of more collectors. This is not the only restored copy of a rare card in s current auction. LOTG has a restored Ward Four Base Hits in it's auction ending Saturday. In this case it is literally the only way for a collector to get the card. There are two known copies and the unrestored copy, which sold for between $150,000 and $200,000 in a private sale, is buried in an advanced collection and not coming out. In both cases and others, the restored copy should sell for 10-20% of the unrestored copy, depending on the appearance and the amount of restoration.

[Jobu]

I don't think that photo has been made public. I believe the original seller says he has a photo but won't share it. The cutter is in the clink and there is little hope of getting an image out of him - even if he kept one.

Originally Posted by Fred

Is there a reason the McNall/Gretzky Wagner isn't shown side by side with the uncut panel and the slabbed card?

[RedsFan1941]

good luck with the four base hits

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by RedsFan1941

good luck with the four base hits

LOL. Yeah that was sorta the same thought I had.

[leaflover]

$14,000 for restoration? Heck you can buy a reprint for $2.00.

[calvindog]

I understand that the card is worth at least 200K based on its current price, but I wouldn't pay $100 for it otherwise. I don't mind a trimmed card if the card is impossible to get otherwise -- or prohibitively expensive -- but no way do I want a Frankencard in my collection with unoriginal parts brought into it. It's one thing to color in a border, an entirely different to bring a new border into the card.

[LincolnVT]

Originally Posted by calvindog

I understand that the card is worth at least 200K based on its current price, but I wouldn't pay $100 for it otherwise. I don't mind a trimmed card if the card is impossible to get otherwise -- or prohibitively expensive -- but no way do I want a Frankencard in my collection with unoriginal parts brought into it. It's one thing to color in a border, an entirely different to bring a new border into the card.

Agreed. If they can add borders, why not just do the corners up as well and make it a gem mint / restored.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by leaflover

$14,000 for restoration? Heck you can buy a reprint for $2.00.

A GEM MINT 10 reprint might cost you a couple more bucks...but at least it's graded and you know it's an authentic reprint.

Is there a link to the auction with the Wagner that was restored to the tune of $14K?

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Jobu

I don't think that photo has been made public. I believe the original seller says he has a photo but won't share it. The cutter is in the clink and there is little hope of getting an image out of him - even if he kept one.

Re-cutter. The card had already been cut off the strip when he bought it.

[barrysloate]

I'm not comfortable with the AUTHENTIC designation. An authentic card should be one that is 100% original, but has a major problem like a missing piece or a punch hole that doesn't qualify it for a numerical grade.

But the added paper, coloring, glue, etc. is not authentic to the card. It is foreign material. I think it should read RESTORED in the upper right corner, and the word AUTHENTIC be removed.

Do others agree with this?

[ejharrington]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

I'm not comfortable with the AUTHENTIC designation. An authentic card should be one that is 100% original, but has a major problem like a missing piece or a punch hole that doesn't qualify it for a numerical grade.

But the added paper, coloring, glue, etc. is not authentic to the card. It is foreign material. I think it should read RESTORED in the upper right corner, and the word AUTHENTIC be removed.

Do others agree with this?

It says Restored right on the top

[barrysloate]

Originally Posted by ejharrington

It says Restored right on the top

Yes, I know. I would leave the RESTORED part and remove the AUTHENTIC. I really don't feel that is an authentic card in the strictest sense. Parts of it are, but not all of it. At minimum, a better description is warranted.

[unamuzd1]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

Yes, I know. I would leave the RESTORED part and remove the AUTHENTIC. I really don't feel that is an authentic card in the strictest sense. Parts of it are, but not all of it. At minimum, a better description is warranted.

This was my reaction as well.

Of course, I'm one of those weirdos who would rather have the totally-jacked original version in his collection.

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

I'm not comfortable with the AUTHENTIC designation. An authentic card should be one that is 100% original, but has a major problem like a missing piece or a punch hole that doesn't qualify it for a numerical grade.

But the added paper, coloring, glue, etc. is not authentic to the card. It is foreign material. I think it should read RESTORED in the upper right corner, and the word AUTHENTIC be removed.

Do others agree with this?

Now that I would buy!

Hi, Barry,

Larry

[drmondobueno]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

I'm not comfortable with the AUTHENTIC designation. An authentic card should be one that is 100% original, but has a major problem like a missing piece or a punch hole that doesn't qualify it for a numerical grade.

But the added paper, coloring, glue, etc. is not authentic to the card. It is foreign material. I think it should read RESTORED in the upper right corner, and the word AUTHENTIC be removed.

Do others agree with this?

Nope.

[mq711]

PSA refused to grade a 71T because they said color was added, why not a restored "grade."

[LincolnVT]

Why wasn't the original card cut into pieces so that several 200k+ restored cards could be made?

[mrvster]

I am in complete agreement with you