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[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Over the last 27 years I have opened hundreds of packs and browsed through countless thousands of other 1991 Kayo cards. I have never, ever seen one of the alleged autographed insert cards until now:

Wow, that's a new one on me. I've probably opened at least a couple cases worth of these, have sold several cases worth of single boxes and have a couple cases put away and have always been suspicious that these never even existed.

I've told people straight out, you're not going to get a signed card in this box, regardless what is says in the advertising on the box.

[Exhibitman]

And I would keep on telling them that, Dave.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

And I would keep on telling them that, Dave.

Would be curious to know if any others have ever popped up.

Must be Powerball type odds pulling one of these cards.

[Exhibitman]

The only reference I can find to the signature cards is on Jeff Allender's checklist site, where he checklists a red bordered Arguello. Since it references the border color difference I think the report of the Arguello is credible. Allender claims (without foundation) that the insertion ratio is 1:2160 packs, but is "reportedly scarcer." Yeah, no $hit, Sherlock. A total of two cards identified in the hobby over 27 years is definitely scarcer than one every 60 boxes (5 cases). I'm thinking that finding one is more akin to this scenario:



As I recall from reading Shark Tank, when Upper Deck invented the signed insert around this time, the executive who came up with it was inspired by Willie Wonka and wanted it to be like pulling a golden ticket. If Kayo followed suit, the cards may be unique. We didn't really start thinking about larger hit counts until years later.

[Peter_Spaeth]

So Adam under what circumstances did you come across this one?

[sthoemke]

I can personally vouch for opening 10+ boxes, and not getting any auto cards.

Seriously, 80-90 percent of the print run probably remains unopened.

Does anyone have any contacts to reach Williams and ask him the number of cards he signed?

[sthoemke]

Picked up 1946-47 Propagandas Montiel Reyes del Deporte - Primo Carnera.

[sthoemke]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

The only reference I can find to the signature cards is on Jeff Allender's checklist site, where he checklists a red bordered Arguello. Since it references the border color difference I think the report of the Arguello is credible. Allender claims (without foundation) that the insertion ratio is 1:2160 packs, but is "reportedly scarcer." Yeah, no $hit, Sherlock. A total of two cards identified in the hobby over 27 years is definitely scarcer than one every 60 boxes (5 cases). I'm thinking that finding one is more akin to this scenario:

...

It is Carlos Palomino, not Arguello, who is referenced as a signature card.

http://www.nslists.com/kayobox.htm

[sthoemke]

This article states "So far, more than 250 million First Round cards have been printed and distributed..."

https://www.thefreelibrary.com/Kayo+...ena-a011423282

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by sthoemke

This article states "So far, more than 250 million First Round cards have been printed and distributed..."

https://www.thefreelibrary.com/Kayo+...ena-a011423282

Yeah, it's a typical early 90's overproduction run. Totally over-estimated the market for boxing cards.

Similar story with AW (All World) the same year. Differences in distribution. It seems AW produced way less unopened product and way more factory sets, and Kayo stuck to mainly the unopened product, while creating less factory sets.

5 years later Ringside was a lot more savvy and sophisticated with it's release, and was much more transparent with it's chase card, autograph insert strategy. Still overproduced but not quite to the extent of the 91' releases.

I'm not sure of the full autograph insert list for this set. I don't think it's exactly a remarkable line-up of boxers, but at least they are attainable.

Still not successful enough to carry over into another series of cards until the modern day lineup of hobby boxes started coming out with much more limited distribution.