Mastro Auctions: Looking for Former Employees

[Jenx34]

Originally Posted by irv

When I first started reading this thread, I agreed with most that everyone deserves a second chance but the more opinions I read and the more I learned about the man the more I changed my thoughts on this.

Currently I am still on the fence, with a slight tilt to the left, saying no way should he have been hired back into the hobby but I also think if he is being used for his expertise (If he has some?) and providing consultation trying to help clean up the hobby by identifying fraudulent cards and memorabilia, then I am not so sure that is a bad thing.

Someone mentioned in this thread, Frank Abagnale. (Catch me if you can) If I am not mistaken, he was hired as a consultant and has likely helped the U.S. Gov't/FBI/CIA, etc, by identifying same/similar frauds/scams and the like that he once used saving the American people/Gov't millions of dollars?

If this is the case, then I must admit I am all for it, but if he is doing none of this, then no way do I agree with this hiring based on what I have read about the man and how many people, over the years, he has ripped off.

Frank Abagnale:
Legitimate jobs
In 1974, after he had served less than five years of his 12-year sentence at Federal Correctional Institution in Petersburg, Virginia, the United States federal government released him on the condition that he help the federal authorities, without pay, to investigate crimes committed by fraud and scam artists, and sign in once a week.[21] Unwilling to return to his family in New York, he left the choice of parole up to the court and it was decided that he would be paroled in Texas.

After his release, Abagnale tried numerous jobs, including cook, grocer, and movie projectionist, but he was fired from most of these after it was discovered he had been hired without revealing his criminal past. Finding these jobs unsatisfying, he approached a bank with an offer. He explained to the bank what he had done and offered to speak to the bank's staff and show them various tricks that "paperhangers" use to defraud banks. His offer included the condition that if they did not find his speech helpful, they would owe him nothing; otherwise, they would owe him only $500 with an agreement that they would provide his name to other banks.[22] With that, he began a legitimate life as a security consultant.[23]

He later founded Abagnale & Associates, based in Tulsa, Oklahoma,[23] which advises companies on fraud issues. Abagnale also continues to advise the FBI, with whom he has associated for over 40 years, by teaching at the FBI Academy and lecturing for FBI field offices throughout the country. According to his website, more than 14,000 institutions have adopted Abagnale's fraud prevention programs.[24]

Abagnale testified before the US Senate in November 2012 about the vulnerabilities of senior citizens to fraud, particularly stressing the ubiquitous use of Social Security numbers for identification included on Medicare cards.[25][26][27]

I don't know what his role is with Heritage, but Abagnale's is not a good comparison regardless. Abagnale never went to work for a bank where he had access to anything, he was merely a consultant teaching banks to avoid fraud, just as he was doing with the Federal Government.

A proper comparison would be if Mark Theotkis (sp?) would consult with all auction houses that want to pay him to help them prevent fraud, identify counterfeit items, etc.

[mantlefan]

Originally Posted by Jenx34

I don't know what his role is with Heritage, but Abagnale's is not a good comparison regardless. Abagnale never went to work for a bank where he had access to anything, he was merely a consultant teaching banks to avoid fraud, just as he was doing with the Federal Government.

A proper comparison would be if Mark Theotkis (sp?) would consult with all auction houses that want to pay him to help them prevent fraud, identify counterfeit items, etc.

Excellent point, Chris. Frank A. worked to prevent future crimes. Theotakis is not contributing anything to society.

[jerrys]

Mastro Auctions drove up auction bids by a shill bidding scheme on auction items from 2002 to 2009. Only the records from 2007 to 2009 have been recovered and documented by Government agencies. The earlier bidding records from 2002 to 2007 were destroyed. Victim loss during just that period was stated at $1,976,303.00. Mastro paid a $250,000 government fine and served a total 20 month sentence at federal prison camp at Pekin, Il., combined with a half-way house - released in May 2017. No penalty for destroying records. No restitution. The loot remains in the hands of the offender. Crime pays.
Mark Theotikos was released June 2017 from federal camp in Marion, Il.
Doug Allen release date is June, 2019 from federal camp at Perkin, Il.
These were the executives that orchestrated the seven-year fraudulent scheme - some employees had non-prison penalties.
However, there were many non-Mastro associates joined in the fraud by forming active consignor/shill bidder partnerships to participate in the bid boosting scams. These partners have significantly enriched themselves while evading exposure or penalty. Their victims are left without restitutions also.

[chalupacollects]

With no skin in this game the need to chime in hits. Frank Abagnale (whom I have met) turned his life around for the better.

This fellow Mark who I don't know may be on that path also but maybe should show some good faith in offering to make some sort of restitution, otherwise there does not seem to be a reason to grant any trust. If he is sincere about being good for the hobby he should publicly commit to offering up some sort of restitution plan to at least make an effort.

If it cannot be determined who of the victims should get said restitution then maybe publicly donate it to a hobby voted on charity...

Tim Hunt

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

The fact that none of the "big three" have cooperated in trying to get the justice system the whole picture (destroyed records, names of other participants and/or victims) to me speaks volumes, as does a lack of even token restitution.

[egbeachley]

Originally Posted by jerrys

Only the records from 2007 to 2009 have been recovered and documented by Government agencies. The earlier bidding records from 2002 to 2007 were destroyed. Victim loss during just that period was stated at $1,976,303.00.

If I recall correctly, the way the victim loss amount was calculated was ridiculous. They considered one shill bid made at $50 towards an item that eventually sold for $5,000 as being a loss to victims of $5,000.

Not defending, just pointing it out.

[ajg]

When the book or movies is written it should be called "The Big Shill"

[Yoda]

I would have to believe that the public shame, embarrassment and ruined reputations must be much worse than the prison time served by these three.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Yoda

I would have to believe that the public shame, embarrassment and ruined reputations must be much worse than the prison time served by these three.

Seriously? I would imagine there are few things in life worse than incarceration, even in minimum security facilities.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Yoda

I would have to believe that the public shame, embarrassment and ruined reputations must be much worse than the prison time served by these three.

I would agree to a point, but if you' are getting out of prison and immediately being hired by a leader in the very industry in which you committed your crime, where's the shame, embarrassment and ruined reputation?

[Dewey29]

I would like to start with a full disclosure by stating that I joined this board today with the sole purpose of posting a response to comments in this thread. I have known Mark personally and professionally for more than 30 years and I had a couple purchases with Mastro but don’t believe I was defrauded in any way. I also happily wrote a letter to the judge prior to Mark’s sentencing. My letter in short said Mark is not a bad person. He is a good person that made a bad decision (or decisions). I will follow up on that in a moment.

The first question that I must ask the board is how many of you actually read the full court documents including the sentencing hearing? I’m not calling anyone out, just asking as I imagine some (not all) posting on here have not. Reading those documents can make you very happy you’re not an attorney, but without reading them you may not have all the facts.

There was a poster on this thread that raised the issue of hiring Mark and compared him to Bill Mastro. That is like comparing apples and oranges as evidenced by the U. S. Attorney Zachary Fardon who admitted Mark was largely following the orders of his bosses rather than orchestrating the scheme. He said Mark “opted to take a hands-on role to promote shill bidding, rather than demand change or at least leave the company and find a new position.”

Before anyone reacts, Mark was guilty of committng a crime. He confessed to that and there is no disputing that. However, there is a major difference between being the head of an organization that comes up with a scheme to defraud and a subordinate that is following orders/instructions. Certainly still illegal, but very very different IMO.

For anyone that believes Mark made a fortune through this crime, I have attached a link below to an article which states “from 2002 to 2008, Theotikos worked for Mastro, where he participated in auction operations at a salary of about $100,000 per year.” Now $100k is a solid salary, but how many of you would go through what he has for a $100k salary for 6 years? The reality here is Mark was put in a bad spot by Mr. Mastro and/or Mr. Allen. Mark should have made the decision to leave the company and find new employment. He chose to stay and through that decision committed a crime for which he has paid severely (and everyone on here is entitled to their own opinion on the severity).

For anyone that feels like he hasn't been punished enough let me pose a question. How many of you would be willing to up and quit your job if your current boss asked you to do something you thought was illegal or immoral? It’s easy to cast stones, but when you’re in that situation and the sole earner while raising a family it’s not an easy decision. Some may say, he should have gone to another auction house. That’s a fair statement. How many other auction houses are there in Chicago? I don’t believe there are any. So let me ask the question again in a different way. How many of you would quit your job and relocate your entire family to another state because you thought what your boss was asking you to do was illegal or immoral? If you’re boss is telling you to do you’re not the bad guy right? Besides if you speak up and criticize your boss your the troublemake that isn’t a team player. That will really help you with getting your next job. Right? It’s a very very tough thing to do and I would bet if people are being honest with themselves, most would stay and begrudgingly do what they were asked to do.

To recap, Mark did commit a crime and was convicted of that crime. He has served his sentence and paid a steep price for his actions. I’m not making any excuses for him. However, I stand by my letter to the judge. Mark is a good man that made a bad decision. Anyone that thinks Mark would ever make the same mistake again has simply never met Mark.

Thanks for allowing me to post here and I hope I didn’t offend too many people as that’s not my intent. Those that have been wronged by Mastronet are certainly well within their rights to be upset. Having good knowledge of what really transpired leads me to believe their anger may be misplaced which is why I wanted to make this post.

https://www.sportscollectorsdaily.co...yee-sentenced/

[Stonepony]

Well just a couple comments to the above post.
1) The " good guy who made bad decisions" and " just following orders " arguments hold NO water with me with regard to guilt.
2) If my boss asked me to do something illegal or immoral- hell
yes I would move on
3) I have made my share of bad decisions/ choices during my lifetime.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by Dewey29

Before anyone reacts, Mark was guilty of committng a crime. He confessed to that and there is no disputing that. However, there is a major difference between being the head of an organization that comes up with a scheme to defraud and a subordinate that is following orders/instructions. Certainly still illegal, but very very different IMO.

The Nuremberg Defense. Awesome.

There's also a big difference between "making a mistake" and doing the same illegal behavior over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over...you get the point.

It's an absolute joke he got another job with an auction house and an even bigger joke that people on here are defending that.

[drmondobueno]

Originally Posted by ajg

When the book or movies is written it should be called "The Big Shill"

I was thinking “Crime Pays”.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by drmondobueno

I was thinking “Crime Pays”.

you mean white collar crime pays..


easier to steal with a pen versus a gun