Card doctoring...

[drcy]

Originally Posted by Runscott

Many of us have provided concrete examples (before and after pics) of cards slabbed by the TPA's - one of my examples showed the same altered card slabbed and re-slabbed by multiple TPA's as an experiment (not mine) to see what they could get away with. The answer was: 'anything'.

The result of my posting was that I was labeled a trouble-maker and basically told to shut up by more than one Net54 member. As long as there is money to be made, none of those who are profiting want to hear about it. Who's profiting? Most of those who collect slabbed cards.

The same is true on the autograph side, which is why you will see autograph experts going after the low-hanging fruit (blatant forgers who set up their own TPA's, which none of us profit through) and leaving the big TPA's alone. As long as the money keeps flowing everyone is happy.

As I said, if a rule was instituted that the grading margin of error had to included next to the grade on the label, the card owners would protest far more than the graders. It's known as "protecting their investment."

[egbeachley]

Originally Posted by drcy

As I said, if a rule was instituted that the grading margin of error had to included next to the grade on the label, the card owners would protest far more than the graders. It's known as "protecting their investment."

Will never work. TPAs will Consider grading for commons, diluting the grading populations, and "prove" that less than 1% are altered. Then all slabs will say the grade is accurate with 1% margin of error. Kinda understood already since they do have a guarantee reserve on their financial statements.

Just like the law passed some years ago that certain companies must give employees 90-days notice if there may be a plant closure. Since then all employee paychecks give notice that there may be a plant closure.

[drcy]

I know it would likely never happen, but duly note that I said put the margin of error on the label, not a different number. The 1% example you use isn't the margin of error, it's a different calculation. That someone calls his dog a cat doesn't make it a cat.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by drcy

As I said, if a rule was instituted that the grading margin of error had to included next to the grade on the label, the card owners would protest far more than the graders. It's known as "protecting their investment."

That's rich. "Grading margin of error" would mean that if I send in a 6 it comes back a 5.5 or 5 and that's okay. It means that if a big auction house or a popular dealer sends in a 6, it comes back as a 7 and that's okay.

But I wasn't referring to margin of error in grading. I was referring to ignoring doctoring of cards for some submitters.

[rainier2004]

How about we just stop trusting flips and make educated decisions for ourselves? It all comes down to capitalism in the end...I for one try to avoid doctored cards and whether its graded or not matters very little in my assessment.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by rainier2004

How about we just stop trusting flips and make educated decisions for ourselves? It all comes down to capitalism in the end...I for one try to avoid doctored cards and whether its graded or not matters very little in my assessment.

I would turn this around and say for many folks, particularly newer collectors as I mentioned, their attitude is, "whether it's altered or not matters very little in my assessment."

When I see the praise being lavished on people I know to be card doctors or who are outlets for card doctors, because they deliver a card timely, it makes me kinda sick sometimes. Well, that's overstating it, but still.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I would turn this around and say for many folks, particularly newer collectors as I mentioned, their attitude is, "whether it's altered or not matters very little in my assessment."

When I see the praise being lavished on people I know to be card doctors or who are outlets for card doctors, because they deliver a card timely, it makes me kinda sick sometimes. Well, that's overstating it, but still.

Peter, I think only time in the hobby can fix that. I know I have spent countless hours listening to stories. There are more altered cards in high grade holders than anyone wants to admit. If you collect high grade pre-war you should be aware you probably have some altered cards (*in TPG holders). It is a fact. But hey, that card doctor ships fast!!

[swarmee]

And some of them post on this website with no issues. If I ran the board, they would be "gone with the suspension."

[Leon]

Originally Posted by swarmee

And some of them post on this website with no issues. If I ran the board, they would be "gone with the suspension."

Ok, so who are they?

[rainier2004]

Originally Posted by swarmee

And some of them post on this website with no issues. If I ran the board, they would be "gone with the suspension."

Could you please share? I'm sure we would all love to hear that and Leon already seems interested.