NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. When you click on links to eBay on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
ebay GSB
T206s on eBay
Babe Ruth Cards on eBay
t206 Ty Cobb on eBay
Ty Cobb Cards on eBay
Lou Gehrig Cards on eBay
Baseball T201-T217 on eBay
Baseball E90-E107 on eBay
T205 Cards on eBay
Baseball Postcards on eBay
Goudey Cards on eBay
Baseball Memorabilia on eBay
Baseball Exhibit Cards on eBay
Baseball Strip Cards on eBay
Baseball Baking Cards on eBay
Sporting News Cards on eBay
Play Ball Cards on eBay
Joe DiMaggio Cards on eBay
Mickey Mantle Cards on eBay
Bowman 1951-1955 on eBay
Football Cards on eBay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Main Forum - WWII & Older Baseball Cards > Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-09-2017, 03:40 AM
iwantitiwinit's Avatar
iwantitiwinit iwantitiwinit is offline
rob.ert int.rieri
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: NC
Posts: 2,810
Default

Well when I rest my pointer on the picture it's identified as MathewsonCrop I think I'll go out on a limb and say it's Matty.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-09-2017, 08:01 AM
T206Jim's Avatar
T206Jim T206Jim is offline
J1m Ch@pman
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Texas
Posts: 875
Default

Many of you were astute enough the find the embedded clue, others recognized the pose and and a few others.... well it was all in good fun and spirit!

Time for this episode of RPPC Mystery Theater. Here is the story. The image comes from one of a pair of 1913 RPPCs from the August 26, 1913 Cincinnati Reds at New York Giants game at the Polo Grounds.

Polo Grounds RPPC.jpg Matty 1913 RPPC front.jpg

Given the vantage point and the alignment of the straw hats is is obvious the RPPCs are from the same game. For the Who, What, When and Where we turn to our trusty allies the scoreboards, newspapers.com and a couple of contemporary photos.

Here are two known photos of the Polo Grounds, dated on the negatives themselves from the Bain Collection at the Library of Congress. The first from the 1913 World Series at the Polo Grounds with ads on the wall that match exactly with our RPPCs. The second shows the 1913 Carlisle-Dartmouth football game with matching ads as well. The massive right field flag in our RPPC is a clear match for the Polo Grounds.

Polo Grounds 1913 World Series.jpg Polo Grounds 1913 Dartmouth.jpg

This establishes the year, the scoreboards will confirm this and give us the exact date and game details. The scoreboards are a little clearer in person with a loupe magnifier than these enlarged photos.

Dark uniform pitcher RPPC scoreboard.

Scoreboard Johnson.jpg

Light uniform pitcher RPPC scoreboard.

Scoreboard Mathewson.jpg

The details are the same on each scoreboard except the first one is clearly in the bottom of the 3rd and the second is in the top of the 1st (During this era the home team at the ballpark where the game was being played on their scoreboard was listed on the top whereas in the other league games on the scoreboard other home teams were listed on the bottom). The matchups when magnified from the RPPCs show that the four games being played that day are Cincinnati at New York (our game), Chicago at Brooklynn, Pittsburg at Boston and St. Louis at Philadelphia. The only game with runs scored is the one in which St. Louis has scored three runs in the 1st inning at Philadelphia. The bottom right advertises that Cincinnati is “Here Tomorrow”. Checking 1913 box scores when these teams all played each other shows that the only date where St. Louis scored 3 runs in the 1st and Cincinnati played at New York the next day was August 26, 1913. Here is that box score.

Box score.jpg NYT clipping 4th inning.jpg

The scoreboard shows that in the 1st RPPC it is the bottom of the third with the Giants at bat with 2 outs and the 2nd batter in the lineup at bat (Note the “2” batter for NY being moved to the middle “A.B.” column). The “2” batter was the shortstop Art Fletcher. We know the “3” batter, 3rd baseman Tillie Shafer, lead off the 4th with a single according to the August 27th New York Times game report. We can therefore assume Fletcher is in the process of flying out to right for the final out of the 3rd. That places Fletcher running from the plate to first, Shafer on deck, Chief Johnson on the mound watching the fly to right, Johnny Kling behind the plate and Hall of Famer Joe Tinker at shortstop based on the box score.

In the second RPPC, the game is in the top of the 1st with two outs with the fourth slot batter at the plate. Based on the game report in the August 27, 1913 The Sun and the box score we know Bescher was thrown out at second trying to steal for the first out, Bates flew out for the second out, Groh had an infield single and that Marsans the fourth slot batter flew out for the final out. Our shot must show Mathewson on the mound checking Groh at first before delivering the pitch to Marsans at the plate.

The_Sun_Wed__Aug_27__1913_ 1st inning play by play.jpg

It is fascinating to see Christy Mathewson on the mound mimicking his classic T3 pose checking the runner at first base before beginning his windup.

Mathewson crop.jpg

Last edited by T206Jim; 12-09-2017 at 08:10 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-09-2017, 08:09 AM
obcbeatle's Avatar
obcbeatle obcbeatle is offline
Jerry
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 324
Default

That was fun! Cool postcards/research ... as always ... and thanks for sharing!
__________________
Collecting: Anything Larry Doyle (my great, great Uncle), Pre-War/Post-War Giants & Post-War Braves. My Wantlist

Selling: Cards and memorabilia I'm weaning from my collection to fund other collecting interests.
https://www.ebay.com/str/recollectionantiques/
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-09-2017, 09:26 AM
timn1 timn1 is offline
Tim Newcomb
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Illinois
Posts: 1,184
Default Incredible stuff, Jim

He "punctured the empyrean" - I.e. Hit a fly ball. I wish Joe buck could talk like that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by obcbeatle View Post
That was fun! Cool postcards/research ... as always ... and thanks for sharing!
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-09-2017, 02:47 PM
WillowGrove's Avatar
WillowGrove WillowGrove is offline
Peter F
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,128
Default

I’m glad you won that one Jim. Did you own the other one already?

Great job on research.


Again.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-09-2017, 02:53 PM
T206Jim's Avatar
T206Jim T206Jim is offline
J1m Ch@pman
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Texas
Posts: 875
Default

They were sold in an estate sale in Seattle a couple of months ago. Apparently they were right under Jeff P's nose! I won them about a month apart from separate eBay sellers.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-13-2017, 01:36 PM
Leon's Avatar
Leon Leon is offline
Leon
peasant/forum owner
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: near Dallas
Posts: 35,700
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by T206Jim View Post
They were sold in an estate sale in Seattle a couple of months ago. Apparently they were right under Jeff P's nose! I won them about a month apart from separate eBay sellers.
Thanks again for the research, Jim. Great stuff.

.
__________________
Leon Luckey
www.luckeycards.com
Reply With Quote
Reply




Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
I guess we are doing our job....BST idiot gone.... Leon Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 31 01-17-2014 10:32 PM
Any guess who this signature might be? quinnsryche Autograph Forum- Primarily Sports 7 12-24-2013 07:18 AM
Guess who? Exhibitman Autograph Forum- Primarily Sports 6 05-22-2013 06:47 AM
Well...I guess she's going to let it run as is...... Archive Net54baseball Sports (Primarily) Vintage Memorabilia Forum incl. Game Used 8 09-13-2007 07:49 AM
I would guess 1000. How about you? Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 7 10-11-2005 06:00 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:07 PM.


ebay GSB