Seeking VERY RARE 1919 T213 Coupon Cigs Type 3 Factory 8 overprint

[2dueces]

I've never seen those cards! Even old farts like me can learn and be impressed by something everyday. Great cards y'all.

[autograf]

Here's a picture of the (3) I sold around 2002




Woops........didn't keep that picture. Oh well. They're great cards. I know it was Marquard and two 'commons'. Also a Type I but can't remember who that one was. Would love to see the holdings of the investor group. Hopefully they'll show us the ghosts of the South! Good luck finding them.

[Gradedcardman]

Chris,

Good luck in your search. Obviously the guys who have seen your request are not selling at this time.

[tbob]

I was one of the 3 collectors who purchased the "Southern Find" back in the 80's. When we picked and chose the ones we wanted I ended up with a complete set of the 1919 16 for 10 cents set minus one card, and several duplicates including 4 Ty Cobb overprinted backs. Over the years I have sold 3 of the Cobbs and kept one. I also had 85% of the 20 for 10 cent backs with many duplicates. I sold all the duplicate 20 for 10s and then about 20 years ago sold the near set of 20 for 10s. The "Find" was incredible as I had 4 or 5 duplicates of Cobb, Johnson, Matty, etc. Alas I sold my complete set-1 of 1919s to none other than Bill Mastro a long time ago. I sold it for about 10% of what these cards sell for now :-( but that's life. I ended up with a beautiful Cobb overprint and a 1914 Cobb (both batting pose) plus a decent return on my purchase. Today the cards would be worth a small fortune. The other two collectors who split the cards with me have also sold their cards to the hobby many, many years ago. One of the others was John England (deceased) who sold all his cards to Larry Fritsch and I believe the Coupons were a part of that sale. The 1919s were in an average of EX condition, just beautiful.
Tbob
Footnote: I found one previously unlisted 1919 Coupon and notified Lew Lipset who denied the card existed. I remember sending him a xerox of the card but never heard back from him. I can't remember the player's name but it is the only 1919 I've ever seen or heard of the player and in hindsight is incredibly rare. The "Southern Find" never got the noteriety of the Black Swamp Find almost 30 years later but it was incredibly more noteworthy. Not a lot of card collectors today are aware of the Find. I remember in the late 90's and early 00's seeing small lots from these cards pop up occasionally for sale in auctions, primarily Mastro Auctions.
With regard to the 1919 set, my memory is that of the cards in that near set about 15-20 were overprints.

[The Nasty Nati]

Aren't the T213 Type 1s rarer than the Type 3s?

[tbob]

Originally Posted by The Nasty Nati

Aren't the T213 Type 1's rarer than the Type 3's?

Type 1s and Type 3s are almost equally scarce but Type 3 (1919) overprints are rarer than Type 1s but Type 1s are much more scarce than Type 2s (1914).
I used to know a collector who had almost a complete set of the Type 1s but he swore me to secrecy because he was paranoid about burglaries etc and didn't want the noteriety.
There were 0 Type 1s in the Southern Find.

[tbob]

For those who are interested, the seller of the cards was a guy from Louisiana who came to Fort Smith, Arkansas because of John England's card shop. The cards were all loose in a huge brown box. We alternated picking cards in 1-2-3, 3-2-1, 1-2-3, 3-2-1 etc. order as we picked the EXMT and better HOFers and worked our way through the "commons" where at the end we were picking 5 or more at a time because it was taking forever. The third collector was the mother of a board member here FYI. She couldn't be present so I picked for her because she trusted me and wasn't completely trusting of John lol.
I had a similiar situation occur in the late 90's when a different guy from Louisiana came by with a small box of about 200 T205s in beautiful condition but I was a little leary of their provenance and only bought a Matty and a Donlin in NM. He said they were his brother's cards and he wanted to sell them. The guy who bought a few from him was also leary that maybe the brother didn't know they were being sold lol. In hindsight we should have bought them all, I guess. He did promise he would be back with a "substantial amount of Victory back cards" (!!!!!!) but we never heard back from him. That was 20 years ago.

[tbob]

I was one of the 3 collectors who purchased the "Southern Find" back in the 80's. When we picked and chose the ones we wanted I ended up with a complete set of the 1919 16 for 10 cents set minus one card, and several duplicates including 4 Ty Cobb overprinted backs. Over the years I have sold 3 of the Cobbs and kept one. I also had 85% of the 20 for 10 cent backs with many duplicates. I sold all the duplicate 20 for 10s and then about 20 years ago sold the near set of 20 for 10s. The "Find" was incredible as I had 4 or 5 duplicates of Cobb, Johnson, Matty, etc. Alas I sold my complete set-1 of 1919s to none other than Bill Mastro a long time ago. I sold it for about 10% of what these cards sell for now :-( but that's life. I ended up with a beautiful Cobb overprint and a 1914 Cobb (both batting pose) plus a decent return on my purchase. Today the cards would be worth a small fortune. The other two collectors who split the cards with me have also sold their cards to the hobby many, many years ago. One of the others was John England (deceased) who sold all his cards to Larry Fritsch and I believe the Coupons were a part of that sale. The 1919s were in an average of EX condition, just beautiful.
Tbob
Footnote: I found one previously unlisted 1919 Coupon and notified Lew Lipset who denied the card existed. I remember sending him a xerox of the card but never heard back from him. I can't remember the player's name but it is the only 1919 I've ever seen or heard of the player and in hindsight is incredibly rare. The "Southern Find" never got the noteriety of the Black Swamp Find almost 30 years later but it was incredibly more noteworthy. Not a lot of card collectors today are aware of the Find. I remember in the late 90's and early 00's seeing small lots from these cards pop up occasionally for sale in auctions, primarily Mastro Auctions.
With regard to the 1919 set, my memory is that of the cards in that near set about 15-20 were overprints.

[NewOrleansCollector]

I'm a novice here and posted the thread in the wrong category. Spoke to Leon. My apologies gents. Didnt even know if the thread stayed so I did another in the correct place. I did speak to a few guys and made offers. If you were one, they are serious. Some look unbelievable. We consider these royalty in the hobby. Some I just didnt want to insult your intelligence with the offers because i knew they were either unaffordable or important to your collection. I know I wouldnt sell mine either. We "think" there are less than 12 total and only 5-7 HOFers left, Depending on the silent guys. But we do collect and buy often many of the New Oreans printed cards. We are pretty sure the Kottons / Peoples were printed in NY and distributed here only. I own a few of the larger printing facilities here and know that only certain ones were actually printed here. My great grandfather worked for the St. Charles business that printed, cut and distributed the Tango Eggs find. We love those, especially because so many people called the better cut finds reprints due to the glossy velum stocks, which are genuine and not reprints. Thank you for sharing the photos gents. Let us know if there is a specific sales price wanted on any you see or any here. Thanks again and I will start following this thread closer now that I see it is still here. Thanks Leon

[Leon]

Originally Posted by NewOrleansCollector

I'm a novice here and posted the thread in the wrong category. Spoke to Leon. My apologies gents. Didnt even know if the thread stayed so I did another in the correct place. I did speak to a few guys and made offers. If you were one, they are serious. Some look unbelievable. We consider these royalty in the hobby. Some I just didnt want to insult your intelligence with the offers because i knew they were either unaffordable or important to your collection. I know I wouldnt sell mine either. We "think" there are less than 12 total and only 5-7 HOFers left, Depending on the silent guys. But we do collect and buy often many of the New Oreans printed cards. We are pretty sure the Kottons / Peoples were printed in NY and distributed here only. I own a few of the larger printing facilities here and know that only certain ones were actually printed here. My great grandfather worked for the St. Charles business that printed, cut and distributed the Tango Eggs find. We love those, especially because so many people called the better cut finds reprints due to the glossy velum stocks, which are genuine and not reprints. Thank you for sharing the photos gents. Let us know if there is a specific sales price wanted on any you see or any here. Thanks again and I will start following this thread closer now that I see it is still here. Thanks Leon

Very interesting information, Chris. Thanks for sharing. The Tango Eggs cards tidbits are great.

[rg4ne1]

What kind of price range are you considering? I have a factory 8 overprint. Are they really that rare? I have a Hughie Jennings PSA 4.