American Greed-CNBC

[Leon]

Originally Posted by rats60

Not all of us are looking to take advantage the elderly.

Always 2 points of view. I am with the other guys on this one. If you are elderly you should know to do a little homework. I am almost elderly .....if I short sell something then it's no ones fault but my own. I don't believe the Gypsy story about the Carter collection either. That whole situation was just wrong, in looking at it with all of the facts known in the other scams.

On another point, I heard Mastro is putting those restitution checks in the mail soon. Just don't hold your breath....

[Snapolit1]

I see both sides. My parents live in a classic Florida retirement community. Just for fun I have considered putting an ad in a local paper classifieds looking to buy vintage baseball cards. Typically down there the husband kicks the bucket and the wife sells off his stuff. It would be amazing to walk in on some amazing shoebox in the closet, but the temptation to take advantage of some elderly widow -- who really isn't in a position to do a lot of research -- would be strong. How do you fairly tell someone what their cards are worth? I'm sure I could come up with all sorts of numbers. I really don't want to go there as they say. Someone wants my help I will send them to Al or someone else.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Leon

Always 2 points of view. I am with the other guys on this one. If you are elderly you should know to do a little homework. I am almost elderly .....if I short sell something then it's no ones fault but my own. I don't believe the Gypsy story about the Carter collection either. That whole situation was just wrong, in looking at it with all of the facts known in the other scams.

On another point, I heard Mastro is putting those restitution checks in the mail soon. Just don't hold your breath....

So you're OK with all the scammers who prey on the elderly in real estate etc.?

http://www.miamiherald.com/living/article1951047.html

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

So you're OK with all the scammers who prey on the elderly in real estate etc.?

That was a stupid question. No. Are you?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Leon

That was a stupid question. No. Are you?

I didn't think so, then what's the difference?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I didn't think so, then what's the difference?

I think it is deplorable when the elderly get scammed.
What I was referring to is when doing a card deal and I use my thousands of hours of expertise to get a good deal. Why am I not allowed to do that but lawyers use their expertise to charge hundreds of dollars (or more) an hour? Just because my knowledge isn't from formal educating (in this area) doesn't mean it's less valuable. I think using one's expertise is the way to get ahead. And that doesn't mean I have to scam to do it.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Leon

I think it is deplorable when the elderly get scammed.
What I was referring to is when doing a card deal and I use my thousands of hours of expertise to get a good deal. Why am I not allowed to do that but lawyers use their expertise to charge hundreds of dollars (or more) an hour? Just because my knowledge isn't from formal educating (in this area) doesn't mean it's less valuable. I think using one's expertise is the way to get ahead. And that doesn't mean I have to scam to do it.

OK perhaps I read too much into your statement about how the elderly should do their homework.

[Snapolit1]

I knew a lawyer down south who represented an oil and gas company that would offer indigent people money for their properties, without disclosing that hours of research revealed that there were valuable gas or mineral deposits that could be sucked out of their land. Ring the doorbell with a check book in hand. Were the people happy with the deal? Probably. Were they taken advantage of? Probably. Should a buyer have to disclose significant facts not known to the seller? Grey area in a lot of ways.
I think there is a huge difference between getting a good deal and royally screwing someone.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Leon

I think it is deplorable when the elderly get scammed.
What I was referring to is when doing a card deal and I use my thousands of hours of expertise to get a good deal. Why am I not allowed to do that but lawyers use their expertise to charge hundreds of dollars (or more) an hour? Just because my knowledge isn't from formal educating (in this area) doesn't mean it's less valuable. I think using one's expertise is the way to get ahead. And that doesn't mean I have to scam to do it.

A good deal is fine. Paying 1% is another matter.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by rats60

A good deal is fine. Paying 1% is another matter.

LOL....yeah, that is a bit steep. I think I pay about 50% and feel it's a good deal....then I go to sell and lose 5%....

And back to the original topic - I wish more authorities would get involved in the fraud in our hobby. As has been said many times, we are fortunate to have SA Brusokas in the hobby. Hopefully he will be assigned to it permanently.

.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by rats60

A good deal is fine. Paying 1% is another matter.

I don't know at exactly what percentage of the value I would draw the line between getting a good deal and ripping someone off. But I do find it almost laughably ironic that the buyer then turns around and complains about getting cheated.

[Jenx34]

Originally Posted by rats60

A good deal is fine. Paying 1% is another matter.

Here is the problem with that premise. Have you ever had a garage sale? In it's best, if you're lucky, it's controlled chaos. You are trying to keep an eye on multiple people, people are asking questions giving you money for 3, 4 or 5 items and asking you to do quick math while doing everything else.

Your goal is to get rid of as much stuff as possible so you don't have to put it back up, bring it back inside or take it to a donation location. It's a lot of freaking work and usually for not a ton of money. Most people's goal is to get rid of as much crap as possible. We had one recently and my house was chaotic and cluttered for 2 weeks prior and a full week afterward.

In preparation, you put stuff together, try to organize as best as possible and put prices on things. People constantly ask you to take less than your price and you have to decide whether to say yes or tell them to piss off while holding a smile. If you research every item, it will take HOURS and you still won't find all the answers, as Leon intimated. I had some German Beer Steins that I didn't know how old they were. I tried looking them up by the markings and still couldn't find the right answer. Finally, I decided to price them at $20 for the pair because I didn't figure they were older than the 70's or 80s. They didn't sell. Still have them. What if they are much older and worth a lot? I still don't know and haven't continued to search. If someone offered me $15 for the pair I'd have gladly taken it and not looked back. So if they knew something I didn't and I sold them, I wouldn't have known. If I found out later, I'd have thought well shit... But the hours it takes to gain the knowledge Leon speaks of, especially for all kinds of household items is NOT worth it for someone having a freaking garage sale.

The other alternative is to hire a company that does estate sales, pay them to run it and their commission and hope they have the knowledge to make you more money. That doesn't happen for a simple garage sale.

Lastly, what if someone pays $50, $500 or $5,000 and finds out the items are fake? Do they show back up at the guy's house asking for their money back? Hell no.

I think it is absolutely ridiculous that people are acting like he duped the old man. Do you think the guy has the desire or the time to stand there while someone thumbs through cards with everything else going on? He offered a price and it was accepted. It's really easy in hindsight to say "I would have done this or that". I call BS. The old man got what he asked, the buyer got a rare lucky find. It is what it is, but NO ONE got taken advantage of.