Final game of the World Series. Johnson, Mathewson, Cy Young?

[CMIZ5290]

Peter, I hear you. My first choice was Johnson originally until I looked at alot of numbers. Talk about a toss up!

[Peter_Spaeth]

To me Johnson is by a significant margin the best pitcher of all time. Therefore, I would take him. Hard to go wrong with any of these though, or Alexander.

[CMIZ5290]

Johnson 417-279, ERA 2.17
Mathewson 373-188, ERA 2.12

These two were about as good as it gets....

[rats60]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Johnson 417-279, ERA 2.17
Mathewson 373-188, ERA 2.12

These two were about as good as it gets....

Postseason ERA
Johnson 2.52
Mathewson 0.97

I'll take Matty.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by rats60

Postseason ERA
Johnson 2.52
Mathewson 0.97

I'll take Matty.

Small sample size, plus Johnson's was at the very end of his career.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Small sample size, plus Johnson's was at the very end of his career.

In 1924 Wajo was the same age as Jack Morris when he threw 10 scoreless innings in game 7 of the 1991 World Series. If a nonHoF pitcher can be clutch, why should we expect the same from one of the greatest in his most important moment of his career?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by rats60

In 1924 Wajo was the same age as Jack Morris when he threw 10 scoreless innings in game 7 of the 1991 World Series. If a nonHoF pitcher can be clutch, why should we expect the same from one of the greatest in his most important moment of his career?

I find it unpersuasive to make an argument based on one game by one pitcher.

[howard38]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Small sample size, plus Johnson's was at the very end of his career.

Also the live ball era vs. the dead ball era.

[T206Collector]

Matty
1905 World Series

[Sean]

Originally Posted by rats60

Postseason ERA
Johnson 2.52
Mathewson 0.97

I'll take Matty.

Johnson's postseasons came in 1924 and 1925, at the tail end of his career. In his prime he was the best. His 1913 season was literally the best season any pitcher has ever had IMO. I'll take Walter for one game in his prime.

Off topic, but I would love to match him against Bumgarner in a game 7.

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

To me Johnson is by a significant margin the best pitcher of all time. Therefore, I would take him. Hard to go wrong with any of these though, or Alexander.

What do you base that on?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by PhillipAbbott79

What do you base that on?

All the statistical analysis I have read, including that of Bill James, plus all the information on Baseball Reference, plus lots of anecdotal history.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Baseball Reference.


Hall of Fame Statistics





Black Ink
Pitching - 150 (1), Average HOFer ≈ 40

Gray Ink
Pitching - 420 (2), Average HOFer ≈ 185

Hall of Fame Monitor
Pitching - 364 (1), Likely HOFer ≈ 100

Hall of Fame Standards
Pitching - 82 (2), Average HOFer ≈ 50

JAWS
Starting Pitcher (1st):
165.6 career WAR / 89.5 7yr-peak WAR / 127.5 JAWS
Average HOF P (out of 62):
73.9 career WAR / 50.3 7yr-peak WAR / 62.1 JAWS

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Peter, I hear you. My first choice was Johnson originally until I looked at alot of numbers. Talk about a toss up!

You seem to like Johnson. Not me.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by PhillipAbbott79

You seem to like Johnson. Not me.

You bet I do, you might be the only person I've ever heard in the hobby that didn't....

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

You bet I do, you might be the only person I've ever heard in the hobby that didn't....

That is something I felt was accurate. I'm not into Johnson's nearly as emphatically as that, but hey, to each their own.

[TexasLeaguer]

If the pitcher also gets to hit in this hypothetical, I'm going with Babe Ruth...with Bob Gibson getting an honorable mention.