What the hell is the deal with this PWCC auction

[Dpeck100]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Fine, but then don't (PWCC, not you) come on here with all these sanctimonious posts about your policies and supposed anti-fraud efforts. If you are going to talk a big game, then live up to it.

If I were their PR firm I would do what Rick Probstein did and stop posting all together. Every time they post their haters aren't satisfied with the answer and in some cases they have made the perception even worse.

Personally I like the transparency of them attempting to respond but in many cases in life just telling your side of the story gets you no where.

One of the tough parts about Internet communication is there are a lot of tough guys behind a keyboard. Just look at any news story that hits a social media site.

With so many harsh critics they will never win the debate so don't even have one.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Their critics arent satisfied because their answers arent satisfactory much of the time. And i am not hiding behind a keyboard i have had much personal communication with brent and he knows my views on things.

[tothrk]

I have a policy of never bidding in a PWCC auction but considering the shipping is only $30 for this card, I might make a run at it. Also, I'd love to know the history of this card.

[drmondobueno]

but only after my next consignment sells

-Drmondobueno, after 4 Guinness, a visit to the local priest, and a load of truth serum

[ruth-gehrig]

Is Betsy the Press Secretary for Brent?

[SAllen2556]

Originally Posted by Dpeck100

If I were their PR firm I would do what Rick Probstein did and stop posting all together. Every time they post their haters aren't satisfied with the answer and in some cases they have made the perception even worse.

Personally I like the transparency of them attempting to respond but in many cases in life just telling your side of the story gets you no where.

One of the tough parts about Internet communication is there are a lot of tough guys behind a keyboard. Just look at any news story that hits a social media site.

With so many harsh critics they will never win the debate so don't even have one.

C'mon now. That's naive. Look at it from a business standpoint. What was their motivation to institute, and more importantly, publicly state their stance against bid retractions? Because they determined that in the long run it would help their business, and profits. Fine.

But why go public with the policy at all? If you run your business with integrity you don't need to shout about it. Just do it. People will figure it out on their own. They went public because they thought it was in the best interest of their bottom line. And at this point, it seems to have backfired.

But remember, PWCC is the one who took to the internet and shouted, "We're the ones you can trust." Well, if you're going to go public about it and use it to market your company, you can't complain when people call you on it, can you?

[Dpeck100]

Originally Posted by SAllen2556

C'mon now. That's naive. Look at it from a business standpoint. What was their motivation to institute, and more importantly, publicly state their stance against bid retractions? Because they determined that in the long run it would help their business, and profits. Fine.

But why go public with the policy at all? If you run your business with integrity you don't need to shout about it. Just do it. People will figure it out on their own. They went public because they thought it was in the best interest of their bottom line. And at this point, it seems to have backfired.

But remember, PWCC is the one who took to the internet and shouted, "We're the ones you can trust." Well, if you're going to go public about it and use it to market your company, you can't complain when people call you on it, can you?

First of all just by looking at the shear volume of listings they have I am not so sure it has hurt their business. It might have been five years or so ago when I first came across their auctions as I liked to see what higher end cards were selling for. They averaged in the low 2,000 listings per auction and it was monthly if I recall.

Fast forward to today and that number has sky rocketed. There are segments of the card market that have clearly come down since their attempt at policing auctions and it is probably for two reasons. One they weeded out some bad actors and two the prices on some of the cards had risen so sharply it brought on a lot of supply. They might have actually benefited from the increase in supply. In 2008 and into 2009 people like me actually made more money at the time from people selling out of their investments and then getting into more conservative ones. The market was collapsing but my commission run was rising.

How much did their policy affect their profits? Obviously you or I have no clue but if their listings increased during that time period and they were able to auction off Pop 1's like this, it is very possible their business hasn't declined at all.

I think when Brent started posting a year and a half or so ago it was a good thing. I thought he did a good job at articulating that they were aware of some problems and it seemed sincere to this naive person. That said the crowd hasn't gotten any quieter and in the past six months since Betsy took over it hasn't helped. Like I said I would just go silent and run their business and let the market dictate their success. I also think they need to be careful with what they say as it could be used against them in court and getting into back and forth responses with people on the Internet about sensitive issues doesn't seem wise.

If you look at that situation with the Dimagio card they are dealing with a loose cannon and there is no winning a pissing contest with a person like that behind a computer screen.

If PWCC is so bad then someone out there should come up with a better model and put them out of business. In the mean time from what I can see their lead and market share just keeps growing so they are doing something right.

[Stampsfan]

Originally Posted by Dpeck100

Your right. That is why I chose a career path that uses my math skills, economics knowledge and verbal communications skills and it has served me quite well.

Originally Posted by Dpeck100

First of all just by looking at the shear volume of listings they have....

Wow, am I ignorant. All this time I thought "shear volume" was the amount of wool cut from a sheep.

[ALR-bishop]

Bob--I thought shear involved a deformation of an object in which parallel planes remain parallel but are shifted in a direction parallel to themselves. I guess you could try that with sheep too.

[Dpeck100]

Originally Posted by Stampsfan

Wow, am I ignorant. All this time I thought "shear volume" was the amount of wool cut from a sheep.

Thankfully I have spell check and grammar check on my side for work related stuff.

[Leon]

I think this is where the moderator comes in and says, anyone can say pretty much what they want to (obviously) but as per the rule at the top of every page, your full name needs to be in your post, signature etc.... or you need to have something that quickly leads to your full name (a website address, blog with name etc...)....thanks all. OH, and if you gave an opinion and don't put your name there, or edit your comments, don't be surprised to see your name there.

.

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by Dpeck100

If I were their PR firm I would do what Rick Probstein did and stop posting all together. Every time they post their haters aren't satisfied with the answer and in some cases they have made the perception even worse.

Personally I like the transparency of them attempting to respond but in many cases in life just telling your side of the story gets you no where.

One of the tough parts about Internet communication is there are a lot of tough guys behind a keyboard. Just look at any news story that hits a social media site.

With so many harsh critics they will never win the debate so don't even have one.

He hasn't been relevant in a very long time in my opinion. It looks like he got the justice that he needed. My guess is, so will PWCC.

[Dpeck100]

Originally Posted by PhillipAbbott79

He hasn't been relevant in a very long time in my opinion. It looks like he got the justice that he needed. My guess is, so will PWCC.

Please clarify your post. Not sure exactly what you mean.

[PhillipAbbott79]

He hasn't had any big dollar cards in a long time. Maybe a few, but nothing to the level he had a few years ago. I would say also particularly true in pre war. I don't follow anything other than that.

[Dpeck100]

Originally Posted by PhillipAbbott79

He hasn't had any big dollar cards in a long time. Maybe a few, but nothing to the level he had a few years ago. I would say also particularly true in pre war. I don't follow anything other than that.

Gotcha. I saw this card earlier they are selling. In general clearly Probstein lost the market share to PWCC.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1952-Topps-3...wAAOSwfVpYs2JR

[PhillipAbbott79]

Solid chance that is what happened. PWCC doubled and Probstien lost to him.

I believe we will see an awaking with him too, but it may take some time.

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by Dpeck100

Gotcha. I saw this card earlier they are selling. In general clearly Probstein lost the market share to PWCC.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1952-Topps-3...wAAOSwfVpYs2JR

I believe the 52 mantle is destined for a SIZABLE down tick. I don't trust anything in the 50s, for lots of reasons. God bless anyone that has the kind of cash to lay on a card that is likely still in hundreds or thousands of peoples attics untouched for 50 years only a few feet from its original owner in that condition.

There are other things keeping that card down, particularly the grading company.

That type of card is not for me at that type of price tag.

[CrackaJackKid]

[QUOTE=PhillipAbbott79;1668742]I believe the 52 mantle is destined for a SIZABLE down tick. I don't trust anything in the 50s, for lots of reasons. God bless anyone that has the kind of cash to lay on a card that is likely still in hundreds or thousands of peoples attics untouched for 50 years only a few feet from its original owner in that condition.

Exactly!! Just think what the pop reports will be like in 10 years for the Mantle,Koufax,Mays and Clemente rookie cards.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by PhillipAbbott79

I believe the 52 mantle is destined for a SIZABLE down tick. I don't trust anything in the 50s, for lots of reasons. God bless anyone that has the kind of cash to lay on a card that is likely still in hundreds or thousands of peoples attics untouched for 50 years only a few feet from its original owner in that condition.

There are other things keeping that card down, particularly the grading company.

That type of card is not for me at that type of price tag.

I would agree that the past couple of years have seen some irrational exuberance on that card. Even at the lower grades. You could get a nice 4 for under 15 in 2014 or perhaps even into the next year, yet last year I heard of nice 4s selling in the 60s. That, to me, makes little sense.