Money in the hobby

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Not trying to push any political buttons, but we are a country of immense wealth disparity. I spend a decent amount of time down the Jersey shore, in an area that was devastated by Hurricane Sandy. Every grandma and grandpa bungalow that was destroyed by the storm has been replaced by a mansion 5 times larger. With a pool in the backyard. And it isn't a station wagon in the driveway but 2 BMWs. My wife constantly says to me "are there really that many people with so much money." Yes, there are. At least within driving distance of Wall Street. Some of these people spend $50,000 on a watch. Some have wine cellars with a half a million dollars of wine. Some spend hundreds of thousands buying racehorses. To spend $300,000 on a baseball card thinking (a) its really cool and (b) it very likely will appreciate or at least hold its value doesn't seem like a crazy idea at all. If you can say this is a 1 of 1 or a 1 of 10 of anything, I think it's a fine investment -- if you are rich and diversified. I have no doubt that a good scandal would hit the industry hard. And then it would come back. The racing industry has a scandal every few months and rich people still spend $5 million or more on untested, unproved race horses.

It's not the Mantle cards of the Satchel Paiges or the Babe Ruths that have me scratching my head. But people spending $50,000 on an unopened pack. Yeah, I'm not so sure about that.

As to the first point, the last 30 years have been a great experiment in economics. When you cut taxes repeatedly and create other loopholes for the benefit of extremely wealthy people, they were supposed to put that money to productive use in business and grow everyone's wealth, but the reality is that they buy more toys instead. Supposedly high end cards (I say supposedly because there are so many really bad altered prewar cards in high end PSA holders) are just another rich boys' toy.

[rainier2004]

I do want to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread, there have been some very well though-out responses and posts that have been rather respectful and I have enjoyed this talk.

One final word on the reproduction of vintage paper...I don't know, I went to a restoration studio where CHUNKS of paintings and art that were created 200-300 years were missing. The art restorers created his own stock, filled in the voids and NOTHING glowed under a black light. To my untrained eye, it looked perfect...bb card stock can be reproduced w/o detection of tpgs.

This thread does need a card, this would be my favorite WaJo and no, its not mine.

[hangman62]

I thinking spending thousands of dollars on baseball cards is stupid thing to do

( and this coming from a long time passionate collector,who loves cards and the hobby)

I sometimes wish the whole baseball card business would go belly up/cards totally worthless/ bankrupt /useless

Then lets see whos left who really truly enjoys the " worthless cardboard photos" ..for what they are

[obcbobd]

Originally Posted by hangman62

i sometimes wish the whole baseball card business would go belly up/cards totally worthless/ bankrupt /useless

then lets see whos left who really truly enjoys the " worthless cardboard photos" ..for what they are

yes!

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by obcbobd

yes!

I don't understand that sentiment at all. If you enjoy collecting for whatever reason, why would other people's motives for what they are doing ruin it for you? Just do you own thing and be happy. Why would it irk you that certain high end cards that most of us aren't buying are soaring into the stratosphere. Just let it be. Everytime I go to to a Met game there are people sitting in $1000 seats. Whatever. I'm happy in a $100 seat. I'm happy wearing suits off the rack and some dudes will only wear custom made. Makes the world go round.

[MattyC]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

I don't understand that sentiment at all. If you enjoy collecting for whatever reason, why would other people's motives for what they are doing ruin it for you? Just do you own thing and be happy. Why would it irk you that certain high end cards that most of us aren't buying are soaring into the stratosphere. Just let it be. Everytime I go to to a Met game there are people sitting in $1000 seats. Whatever. I'm happy in a $100 seat. I'm happy wearing suits off the rack and some dudes will only wear custom made. Makes the world go round.

Exactly. "Just do you own thing and be happy," well said. Seems like there's a lot of bile and general bitterness at money out there.

When I'm looking at my cards by myself or with my son or my brothers or cousins who collect, I'm loving collecting and the game of baseball and the specific cards I've found and chosen for their specific attributes— I'm certainly not wasting my energy thinking about what some other dudes are buying or why they're buying it or for how much, or what's overgraded, or some hypothetical scam. And yes, I'd bet many collectors would still love their cards just the same if they were suddenly worth nothing. If we didn't open packs and collect as kids for money, I don't see why we'd do so now, since a big part of collecting is to reconnect with one's youth and stay young inside.

[obcbobd]

Originally Posted by MattyC

Seems like there's a lot of bile and general bitterness at money out there.

a big part of collecting is to reconnect with one's youth and stay young inside.

No bile. No bitterness towards money, people who have it (and I have my share). But as you said collecting for me is a reconnection to my youth and that is to the cardboard itself, not the monetary value. So, if all my cards lose their value, I'm ok, means I can buy more . They aren't investments. They're something much more innocent.

[Bicem]

Originally Posted by rainier2004

This thread does need a card, this would be my favorite WaJo and no, its not mine.

Great choice in a thread relating to the incompetentcies of the grading companies!

[rainier2004]

Originally Posted by Bicem

Great choice in a thread relating to the incompetentcies of the grading companies!

heh heh heh...

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

As to the first point, the last 30 years have been a great experiment in economics. When you cut taxes repeatedly and create other loopholes for the benefit of extremely wealthy people, they were supposed to put that money to productive use in business and grow everyone's wealth, but the reality is that they buy more toys instead. Supposedly high end cards (I say supposedly because there are so many really bad altered prewar cards in high end PSA holders) are just another rich boys' toy.

No, they are wise investments. People are reinvesting their money to maintain and increase their financial position. It is no different than buying stocks, bonds, etc. If you don't think the average person is doing well, I would suggest you take a trip to Haiti or Afghanistan.