1933 Goudey Ruth- Questionable Authenticity? Not really...

[PhillipAbbott79]

There are dozens of ways they could render a decision without using a derivative of "authentic".

Here are a few:

No Decision
Undetermined
N4

[Leon]

Originally Posted by PhillipAbbott79

There are dozens of ways they could render a decision without using a derivative of "authentic".

Here are a few:

No Decision
Undetermined
N4

Actually, the flip should say COU for Counterfeit....and leave it at that. It is what it is. On another situation, I sent in the W575-1s I picked up recently, to SGC. They said they have to put "Hand Cut" on the flips even though they admit they aren't hand cut. Makes sense to me.... not.

[bn2cardz]

On a facebook group (which does have some vintage users but tend towards modern) there was card recently pictured with the same auth? determination from PSA. The poster was asking what it meant. Most people were correct in saying it was a fake, but a few others tried arguing that it wasn't certain. They insisted that the question mark meant that PSA didn't know if it was authentic and that PSA just couldn't determine authenticity.

It is because of those few that people still sell these items this way.

[Paul S]

Last year, maybe the year before, someone won one of my auctions for two Mantles: Post Cereal and the Life magazine insert. The condition was low end so I'm not sure why he'd pay to have them graded (PSA) but that's his business, not mine. Anyway, they came back "? AUTHTCT". He didn't want a refund, but was sincerely disappointed and bummed out, therefore I am too. Now, I know both cards have been counterfeited in the past, except I had them since the Sixties before the shenanigans started. If they can't render an opinion, shouldn't they be refunding fees, if any, or at least shipping?

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by Leon

Actually, the flip should say COU for Counterfeit....and leave it at that. It is what it is. On another situation, I sent in the W575-1s I picked up recently, to SGC. They said they have to put "Hand Cut" on the flips even though they admit they aren't hand cut. Makes sense to me.... not.

That would be correct, but I was showing how questionably authentic still has some ways that can be addressed IF their concern is with the legality of it.

[Exhibitman]

I understand and appreciate the desire for certainty, but that is not what PSA is paid to do. The QA response is the equivalent of "not guilty"; it isn't an affirmative assertion of "innocent", it is a representation that the evidence didn't prove guilt. The TPG isn't asked to determine if an item is "counterfeit", it is asked to determine if an item is authentic and if so, what condition it is in. The QA statement means that the TPG couldn't state it was authentic, not that the item is counterfeit. It is certainly motivated by legal considerations; if you want the TPGs to issue a damning "counterfeit" designation on items, i.e., to take an affirmative position and render a conclusive opinion that will cost the owners real money, you need to be prepared to pay more for grading services to cover the risks of errors and the damages that may be awarded to an injured party. We aren't going to get that for $7.

[drcy]

Adam is correct, but it is also true that the term they use is needlessly strange and ambiguous. They could use the label of "not graded or holdered" or something like that.

[bobbyw8469]

Questionable Authenticity fits the bill just fine. A lot of devious people try to play havoc with the wording though just to pass their fakes off as real.

[bnorth]

This post should kill this thread.

This is really how simple it is. Both card pictured are counterfeit. The one sent to PSA got a 8 NM-MT grade. The one sent to SGC came back with a flip that says NO and with a card with COUNTERFEIT checked. Any questions?

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by bnorth

This post should kill this thread.

This is really how simple it is. Both card pictured are counterfeit. The one sent to PSA got a 8 NM-MT grade. The one sent to SGC came back with a flip that says NO and with a card with COUNTERFEIT checked. Any questions?

but Ben...that's not possible?!?!?!? PSA is the 2nd coming and SGC sucks. right????