Problems with VCP and the Hobby

[ezez420]

How? VCP pulls data from houses if they permit. You can see which houses permit. I think to help the hobby, they can help by sending data to VCP of cards that are not paid for. VCP can do a better job of making sure there data is accurate. Especially on cards that do not sell often.

[packs]

VCP is just a data mine. All of the information on VCP is information available to you as well if you search for it. You wouldn't know anything beyond a sale price unless you spoke to the buyer or the seller. I don't think it's fair to put that initiative on a service like VCP.

[Beastmode]

Originally Posted by packs

VCP is just a data mine. All of the information on VCP is information available to you as well if you search for it. You wouldn't know anything beyond a sale price unless you spoke to the buyer or the seller. I don't think it's fair to put that initiative on a service like VCP.

++ Don't kill the messenger (VCP). I love VCP and consider it a great resource. I also use POP reports, ebay completed sales, and if available, an AH"s archieves.

There at lots of outliers in VCP you need to ignore, (from the "buying-group" especially). It's not all subjective either. You need to see the trends and get a feel for demand, scarcity, and your own gut.

Always stay within your budget and you will never have to worry about shilling. This is a hobby, learn to enjoy coming in second.

[drcy]

I doubt that many to most auction houses would be willing to give out which lots were paid for and which not, which were sold to second place bidders, etc. 1) It's internal business and 2) it's extra work for no pay. I doubt that after a long day's work, an auctioneer, database manager or accountant says "Hey, let's crunch more numbers for free."

[tschock]

Originally Posted by drcy

I doubt that many to most auction houses would be willing to give out which lots were paid for and which not, which were sold to second place bidders, etc. 1) It's internal business and 2) it's extra work for no pay. I doubt that after a long day's work, an auctioneer, database manager or accountant says "Hey, let's crunch more numbers for free."

And it's not in their best interests. Lower realized prices this time lead to lower potential next time (in the psyche of the bidders).

[drcy]

A fair compromise is if VCP helps an auction house with packaging then the auction house will crunch those numbers for them.

[Baseball Bob]

Two thoughts/comments:
1). It's kind of early to call a market top when it has been just two months since the National; and no one who sees a 5000% price run-up and shouts "bubble!" is really a genius, are they?
2) VCP only ought to be used as a guide. Given the huge number of direct untraceable transactions that take place out there, they can only see a small fraction of the market and only that which wants to divulge itself to them. They are not "market police".
Best to cut them a break...

Eric

[Snapolit1]

As far as I can tell the "buying group" is a coordinated cabal of know nothing billionaire bankers from New York City who have gotten done manipulating all sorts of markets (real estate, art, pork bellies, orange juice futures) and have now moved on to modern Topps rookie issues from the 1960s. Just a guess though.

[ezez420]

That is a terrible reason. This is a data feed. I would guess it would effect the online eBay auction houses the most but a program could be developed to feed this data at the end of the auction rather than instantaneously.

It is in their best interest to do it as ultimately people will be deterred from collecting. Which in turn leads to less consignments. Do you not think that many have not been deterred already from the precipitous manipulated drop in prices from before the National?

Originally Posted by drcy

I doubt that many to most auction houses would be willing to give out which lots were paid for and which not, which were sold to second place bidders, etc. 1) It's internal business and 2) it's extra work for no pay. I doubt that after a long day's work, an auctioneer, database manager or accountant says "Hey, let's crunch more numbers for free."

[packs]

I don't think a deterrence would have to do with reported sales prices. I think any drop in auction house participation is a reflection of mistrust.

[36GoudeyMan]

Not sure I know what/who that is, and what they do....

[MattyC]

Originally Posted by ezez420

Do you not think that many have not been deterred already from the precipitous manipulated drop in prices from before the National?

If one looks at an anomaly or outlier "sale" as either just that, or something more nefarious, such as a fake sale, then one logically shouldn't view subsequent prices lower that that data point as a "precipitous drop."

In other words, the real error in judgment is in looking at one or more outliers-- be they real sales or fake-- and assuming that was the new market.

Re: VCP, it's just a site that aggregates some data. As others have said, interpretation of that incomplete data is on the individual's shoulders.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by drcy

I doubt that many to most auction houses would be willing to give out which lots were paid for and which not, which were sold to second place bidders, etc. 1) It's internal business and 2) it's extra work for no pay. I doubt that after a long day's work, an auctioneer, database manager or accountant says "Hey, let's crunch more numbers for free."

And I hate to say it, but it's in the AH's interest for people to think the sale was real.

[botn]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

And I hate to say it, but it's in the AH's interest for people to think the sale was real.

Exactly. Very good for business and brings in loads of consignments. Smoke and mirrors.

[Snapolit1]

A rising tide lifts all PSA 9s and Gem Mint 10s.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by botn

Exactly. Very good for business and brings in loads of consignments. Smoke and mirrors.

I looked for it a bit, but I saw an auction catalog in another hobby that was primarily stuff that hadn't been paid for over the last several auctions. The intro was pretty harsh, not undeserved just a bit surprising.

I'll have another look for it and see if I can't find the catalog online.

Steve B