John Rogers: From Net 54 to Prison

[SAllen2556]

Very sad to read about Mary Brace and her father's photos. I'd sure like to know why she didn't use an auction house or consider donating them to an institution that could have preserved them. Went for the quick buck I suppose. Too bad.

[rjackson44]

I agree with scott .so sad man.

[thecatspajamas]

Originally Posted by SAllen2556

Very sad to read about Mary Brace and her father's photos. I'd sure like to know why she didn't use an auction house or consider donating them to an institution that could have preserved them. Went for the quick buck I suppose. Too bad.

Not the main point of this thread I know, but for what it's worth, Mary Brace hardly went for the quick buck when it came to the Burke/Brace collection. She operated the business of making prints from the negatives for years as her father's health declined, and continued for a decade after his passing. Without knowing the particulars of the deal with Rogers, I believe the big selling point for her was the promise of a return of digital scans of the negatives from which she could continue to supply prints to players and their families and fans. She could have easily turned the whole thing over to an auction house to part out and maximize her return, but in the end, she took the deal that would (she thought) best enable her to carry on the family business without the labor-intensive handling of the physical negatives.

In the interview below, she alludes to a website that was supposed to have been set up for the Burke/Brace archive that would have all of the digitized photos available, similar to what Rogers had done with the Conlon archive.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/chi-14...miumvideo.html

I don't think she went for the quick buck at all, but perhaps let her desire to have the digitized archive override her business savvy. At the time, with Rogers having done similar deals with multiple newspapers to digitize their archives, having the Conlon website up and running, and by all appearances having the financial and physical ability to pull off what he was proposing, I don't think Mary had any real reason to question the deal that Rogers was offering. In hindsight, even in the quotes in the previous linked articles, she seemed to be lamenting the break-up and loss of the image archive more than the lack of restitution.

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by thecatspajamas

Not the main point of this thread I know, but for what it's worth, Mary Brace hardly went for the quick buck when it came to the Burke/Brace collection. She operated the business of making prints from the negatives for years as her father's health declined, and continued for a decade after his passing. Without knowing the particulars of the deal with Rogers, I believe the big selling point for her was the promise of a return of digital scans of the negatives from which she could continue to supply prints to players and their families and fans. She could have easily turned the whole thing over to an auction house to part out and maximize her return, but in the end, she took the deal that would (she thought) best enable her to carry on the family business without the labor-intensive handling of the physical negatives.

In the interview below, she alludes to a website that was supposed to have been set up for the Burke/Brace archive that would have all of the digitized photos available, similar to what Rogers had done with the Conlon archive.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/chi-14...miumvideo.html

I don't think she went for the quick buck at all, but perhaps let her desire to have the digitized archive override her business savvy. At the time, with Rogers having done similar deals with multiple newspapers to digitize their archives, having the Conlon website up and running, and by all appearances having the financial and physical ability to pull off what he was proposing, I don't think Mary had any real reason to question the deal that Rogers was offering. In hindsight, even in the quotes in the previous linked articles, she seemed to be lamenting the break-up and loss of the image archive more than the lack of restitution.

Very well said. And one of the biggest reasons that no one should feel sympathy for that lying sack of excrement. I hope he rots in prison for years.

[SAllen2556]

Originally Posted by thecatspajamas

Not the main point of this thread I know, but for what it's worth, Mary Brace hardly went for the quick buck when it came to the Burke/Brace collection. She operated the business of making prints from the negatives for years as her father's health declined, and continued for a decade after his passing. Without knowing the particulars of the deal with Rogers, I believe the big selling point for her was the promise of a return of digital scans of the negatives from which she could continue to supply prints to players and their families and fans. She could have easily turned the whole thing over to an auction house to part out and maximize her return, but in the end, she took the deal that would (she thought) best enable her to carry on the family business without the labor-intensive handling of the physical negatives.

In the interview below, she alludes to a website that was supposed to have been set up for the Burke/Brace archive that would have all of the digitized photos available, similar to what Rogers had done with the Conlon archive.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/chi-14...miumvideo.html

I don't think she went for the quick buck at all, but perhaps let her desire to have the digitized archive override her business savvy. At the time, with Rogers having done similar deals with multiple newspapers to digitize their archives, having the Conlon website up and running, and by all appearances having the financial and physical ability to pull off what he was proposing, I don't think Mary had any real reason to question the deal that Rogers was offering. In hindsight, even in the quotes in the previous linked articles, she seemed to be lamenting the break-up and loss of the image archive more than the lack of restitution.

Yes, I can only imagine the degree of her lament. Thanks Lance, that certainly answers the question!

[MULLINS5]

My little brother (29 years old) was recently sentenced to 12 years in federal prison for armed robbery of three banks. He suffered from heroine addiction and believes he would be dead if he wasn't caught. He was a train conductor and made 100k a year, but it wasn't enough. Nobody in the family knew he was on drugs until he was arrested.

As a collector who has been scammed several times in my early days in this hobby, I feel for the victims. I also feel for Rogers because of my personal experience with my brother.

My brother is genuinely remorseful for what he did to the employees and customers in the banks on the days he robbed them. I didn't see anything about Rogers showing remorse for his actions, though I could have easily missed this (please correct me if I am wrong). Other than the victims who would've been scammed in the future, there are no winners here.

[ksabet]

Originally Posted by MULLINS5

My little brother (29 years old) was recently sentenced to 12 years in federal prison for armed robbery of three banks. He suffered from heroine addiction and believes he would be dead if he wasn't caught. He was a train conductor and made 100k a year, but it wasn't enough. Nobody in the family knew he was on drugs until he was arrested.

As a collector who has been scammed several times in my early days in this hobby, I feel for the victims. I also feel for Rogers because of my personal experience with my brother.

My brother is genuinely remorseful for what he did to the employees and customers in the banks on the days he robbed them. I didn't see anything about Rogers showing remorse for his actions, though I could have easily missed this (please correct me if I am wrong). Other than the victims who would've been scammed in the future, there are no winners here.

This is really interesting to me. I have a similar relation in my life and it made me wonder what these guys would have to do to get back in the graces of society let alone the card community.

What amends or actions would these guys need to take in order to have a second chance upon finishing their punishment? Or are their crimes so heinous that they are beyond second chances. I am really on the fence. I want to have compassion for someone after they served their time, but John Rogers may have irreparably damaged innocent families and therefore if they can never be whole why should he?

JP at Memory Lane seems to have bounced back, would it be possible for Mastro or Allen? IMO the callous and repetitive nature of their crimes should have some lifelong repercussion.

[pbspelly]

Originally Posted by MULLINS5

My little brother (29 years old) was recently sentenced to 12 years in federal prison for armed robbery of three banks. He suffered from heroine addiction and believes he would be dead if he wasn't caught. He was a train conductor and made 100k a year, but it wasn't enough. Nobody in the family knew he was on drugs until he was arrested.

.

Not to make light of your family's situation, or your comment, which I found very sad and moving, but I think you mean heroin. A heroine addiction would be someone addicted to Wonder Woman or other leading ladies.

[Rich Klein]

Wonder Woman, Bionic Woman, Bat Girl, etc. Where I do sign up for that addiction

[MULLINS5]

Originally Posted by pbspelly

Not to make light of your family's situation, or your comment, which I found very sad and moving, but I think you mean heroin. A heroine addiction would be someone addicted to Wonder Woman or other leading ladies.

Hah! Thanks for the laugh. Auto-correct strikes again

[Huck]

Originally Posted by SAllen2556

Very sad to read about Mary Brace and her father's photos. I'd sure like to know why she didn't use an auction house or consider donating them to an institution that could have preserved them. Went for the quick buck I suppose. Too bad.

I purchased photographs from Mary Brace on a few occasions. She was always very pleasant to do business with. I was surprised when she sold the collection. She provided me with contact information (John Rogers) of the new owner of the collection. Eventually, I was able to contact John, but due to his lack of returning email messages in a timely matter, I was never able to purchase additional photographs. Ah well, with only $150 at stake, he had bigger fish to fry.

[whitehse]

Originally Posted by biohazard

I purchased photographs from Mary Brace on a few occasions. She was always very pleasant to do business with. I was surprised when she sold the collection. She provided me with contact information (John Rogers) of the new owner of the collection. Eventually, I was able to contact John, but due to his lack of returning email messages in a timely matter, I was never able to purchase additional photographs. Ah well, with only $150 at stake, he had bigger fish to fry.

I had a chance to see Mr. Brace on a daily basis at Wrigley Field when I worked there in the '80's and while he could be occasionally gruff, I found him to be an awesome source of baseball information. He told stories of sitting in the dugout with Ruth and Gehrig and working with and being on a first name basis with most of the legends of the game during the 20th century. The man was like a walking Cooperstown with his stories he had in his head. I was saddened to read that his negatives were sold off and even more saddened to know his family got stiffed in the process. He was a man who was proud of his work and was diligent in everything he did.

Sometimes this awesome hobby just sucks because of the few a******* that are in it......

[Keith_Loving]

Not to bump an old thread, but I wish the contents on the hard drives that he tried to "steal" could be made available online for a price. I am sure there are scans on there that I would buy of particular lesser known players form the 1930s Cardinals teams. Hope the work that was put into scanning images onto the hard drives won't lead to a dead end.

I feel bad for Mary Brace, she had a treasure trove and its gone!

[MikeGarcia]

Originally Posted by Keith_Loving

Not to bump an old thread, but I wish the contents on the hard drives that he tried to "steal" could be made available online for a price. I am sure there are scans on there that I would buy of particular lesser known players form the 1930s Cardinals teams. Hope the work that was put into scanning images onto the hard drives won't lead to a dead end.

I feel bad for Mary Brace, she had a treasure trove and its gone!

...Hello....you sound like you might know 1930's St. Louis Cardinals players ?

..Might you know the names of the players on the two Burke 4 x 6's which are not signed ? The backs are devoid of any identification except for the classic standard stamp : "Geo C. Burke 847 Belmont Ave. Chicago, Ill."---I appreciate any help , thanks , MG54

..

[cardinalcollector]

I believe that is Ed Delker in the middle and Burgess Whitehead on the right.

[thecatspajamas]

Here is the same image in postcard format (with identification penned on the back), and the corresponding "smiling" pose from the same sitting:

[Keith_Loving]

Hi bud, I have an original George Burke Checklist, the players are listed below with their checklist number.

Eddie Delker: 189 N8
Burgess Whitehead: 802 N8

Oddly enough, there are a few signed Eddie Delker JIM ROWE postcards on eBay right now with the same pose.

Cheers,
Keith