T206 Who should be a HOFer that isn't ???

[FourStrikes]

Originally Posted by Topps206

How does this forum feel about Jimmy Sheckard and Cooperstown?

NO Gil Hodges??? NO Dale Murphy? NO Keith Hernandez? NO (insert many far-more-deserving names here, but...)

p.s. I know none of the above are T206, but, just for the sake of argument...sorry, just not feelin' it for Sheckard - UNLESS I was sittin' on a binder full of T206 Sheckard (there's exceptions to every "accepted" rule, ya know???)

JMO

DS

[Topps206]

Originally Posted by FourStrikes

NO Gil Hodges??? NO Dale Murphy? NO Keith Hernandez? NO (insert many far-more-deserving names here, but...)

p.s. I know none of the above are T206, but, just for the sake of argument...sorry, just not feelin' it for Sheckard - UNLESS I was sittin' on a binder full of T206 Sheckard (there's exceptions to every "accepted" rule, ya know???)

JMO

DS

The only one you just mentioned who would get my support for Cooperstown is Hernandez.

Honestly before I started collecting the Monster many of these players I never heard of. I knew the big names like Wagner, Cobb, Plank, Mathewson, Johnson, basically all the Hall of Famers. I also knew of the likes of Dahlen, Magee, Cravath. I couldn't tell you anything about them, but I knew the name. I had no clue who Larry Doyle or Jimmy Sheckard were. This set taught me them and also I learned they were fantastic players.

[bbcard1]

there are lots of problems with the hall of fame, but that's what makes in interesting. If you use the worst player in the hall of fame as the litmus test for who belongs, pretty much everyone north of David Eckstien has an argument. making it more complex, winning 220 games in the 1980s is very different than willing 220 games in 1910 and will be exceedingly different than winning 220 games in 2020, just as hitting 500 homers in the 1930s or 40s is different than doing it in the 1990s. Plus the argument are you ranking players for their longevity or their pinnacle? That's what makes it a good argument.

[Topps206]

How good were they during their pimnacle? How long enough did they play? What position were they?

These are all questions to ask, too.

[packs]

I think the true test should be: was this person one of the three best players at their position during their career? If the answer is yes, then I don't see how that person isn't a HOFer. In the case of Larry Doyle, he was unquestionably the best second baseman of his time. So how is he not a HOFer?

Pitchers would be a different story because at any given time there could be an infinite amount of top pitchers. I wouldn't use the top three as an indicator for them.

[Topps206]

Originally Posted by packs

I think the true test should be: was this person one of the three best players at their position during their career? If the answer is yes, then I don't see how that person isn't a HOFer. In the case of Larry Doyle, he was unquestionably the best second baseman of his time. So how is he not a HOFer?

Pitchers would be a different story because at any given time there could be an infinite amount of top pitchers. I wouldn't use the top three as an indicator for them.

I'd say Doyle was third behind only Collins and Lajoie. In that case, it'd be tough to outdo either of them, but still the best N.L. second baseman in his career.

Also, of the T206 shortstops, I rate Dahlen third behind only Wagner and Davis.

[bravos4evr]

Originally Posted by packs

I think the true test should be: was this person one of the three best players at their position during their career? If the answer is yes, then I don't see how that person isn't a HOFer. In the case of Larry Doyle, he was unquestionably the best second baseman of his time. So how is he not a HOFer?

Pitchers would be a different story because at any given time there could be an infinite amount of top pitchers. I wouldn't use the top three as an indicator for them.

I don't like this argument. What constitutes an era? If we just look at who the top 3 at any given position are without comparing them to the rest of history at said position we are just going to weaken the HOF more than it is already.

Was the player in the top 10-15 all time at their position?

If not were they in the top 10 in the game at any position during their career?

Does that players stats paint a picture of an all time great? Or just a good player who played a position that had poor depth league wide at the time?

[CMIZ5290]

Please end this thread....3 months is long enough....

[Topps206]

Originally Posted by bravos4evr

I don't like this argument. What constitutes an era? If we just look at who the top 3 at any given position are without comparing them to the rest of history at said position we are just going to weaken the HOF more than it is already.

Was the player in the top 10-15 all time at their position?

If not were they in the top 10 in the game at any position during their career?

Does that players stats paint a picture of an all time great? Or just a good player who played a position that had poor depth league wide at the time?

Some of the players you say no to I think pass your litmus test.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by FourStrikes

NO Gil Hodges??? NO Dale Murphy? NO Keith Hernandez? NO (insert many far-more-deserving names here, but...)

p.s. I know none of the above are T206, but, just for the sake of argument...sorry, just not feelin' it for Sheckard - UNLESS I was sittin' on a binder full of T206 Sheckard (there's exceptions to every "accepted" rule, ya know???)

JMO

DS

+1 on Sheckard big time....

[bravos4evr]

Originally Posted by FourStrikes

NO Gil Hodges??? NO Dale Murphy? NO Keith Hernandez? NO (insert many far-more-deserving names here, but...)

p.s. I know none of the above are T206, but, just for the sake of argument...sorry, just not feelin' it for Sheckard - UNLESS I was sittin' on a binder full of T206 Sheckard (there's exceptions to every "accepted" rule, ya know???)

JMO

DS

Dale Murphy was my favorite player growing up, but sadly his career took too much of a nose dive due to injuries to be a HOF'er. Hall of very good yes, but doesn't measure up to the HOF standard.