My PSA Damage Tale

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

I have a stack of signed 8x10's with old scoreboard COAs if you're interested.

Not interested, but let's start with your opening sentence. Are you're inferring that with PSA/DNA (and other like third party authenticators) that the number of fake autographs has decreased in our hobby? Come on, that is certainly not the case. Or are you inferring that autograph collectors can now have peace of mind from a third party authenticated autograph such as by PSA/DNA? If the latter is the case, let's revisit this thread...

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=148790

This was a facsimile autograph that PSA/DNA authenticated as being the real deal. It wasn't a fake or a forgery, it was a copy of the original. A 10 year old with a loupe can tell the difference between a facsimile autograph and one that is actually penned. Why couldn't PSA/DNA? You can't blame this on on "mechanical error" as you PSA apologists like to often do. They simply authenticated a reproduction autograph without looking at it under magnification.

OK, how does this relate to our topic of greed and fraud? Well, it was fraudulently submitted and authenticated and then the greed of the OP wouldn't let him see the fact that it was a fake.

You infer that autograph collecting has become safer with TPG authentication, but how do you explain PSA/DNA authenticating a copy - again, not a forgery - a copy?

What greed and fraud topic do you want to talk about next?

[jhs5120]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Not interested, but let's start with your opening sentence. Are you're inferring that with PSA/DNA (and other like third party authenticators) that the number of fake autographs has decreased in our hobby? Come on, that is certainly not the case. Or are you inferring that autograph collectors can now have peace of mind from a third party authenticated autograph such as by PSA/DNA? If the latter is the case, let's revisit this thread...

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=148790

This was a facsimile autograph that PSA/DNA authenticated as being the real deal. It wasn't a fake or a forgery, it was a copy of the original. A 10 year old with a loupe can tell the difference between a facsimile autograph and one that is actually penned. Why couldn't PSA/DNA? You can't blame this on on "mechanical error" as you PSA apologists like to often do. They simply authenticated a reproduction autograph without looking at it under magnification.

OK, how does this relate to our topic of greed and fraud? Well, it was fraudulently submitted and authenticated and then the greed of the OP wouldn't let him see the fact that it was a fake.

You infer that autograph collecting has become safer with TPG authentication, but how do you explain PSA/DNA authenticating a copy - again, not a forgery - a copy?

What greed and fraud topic do you want to talk about next?

Do you believe more people have purchased forgeries without PSA/DNA certification or with?

Yes, I am claiming that the autograph hobby has become immensely safer for the casual collector. If I look on eBay for signed Mickey Mantle baseballs without third party authentication I 100% believe that I will find more forgeries than searching eBay for baseballs with authentication.

Also, do you believe I can find more eBay listings for fake 1952 Mantles listed as authentic in PSA slabs or raw?

Edited to add: ALSO, are you seriously inferring a casual collector is better off buying a high dollar autograph without any authentication than with? Because I couldn't disagree more with you.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

Do you believe more people have purchased forgeries without PSA/DNA certification or with?

Obviously people have purchased more forgeries w/o. But that’s only because of the false sense of security that the PSA/DNA COA brings. I don’t collect a lot of autographs, but there are people on this forum whose opinions I trust way more than PSA/DNA. You really didn’t address my point about the Cobb. They authenticated a facsimile signature. You’re not getting that. We’re not talking about authenticating a forgery. That’s different. This was a facsimile! How can you trust a company that can’t tell the difference between a facsimile and the real deal? Or how can you trust a company that can’t tell the difference between Karl Malone and Karl Malden? (This is your opportunity to throw out the “mechanical error” excuse).

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=218336

If having that PSA/DNA flip, COA, LOA makes you sleep better at night, then so be it. But that PSA/DNA stamp of approval doesn’t mean anything to me (and there are many like me) when it’s obvious from the two examples I pointed out that they don’t know what they’re doing.

I really wanted our focus to be on cards since that’s what we were originally discussing. There are MORE card doctors today than ever before as a result of grading. The greed and fraud in this hobby has caused card doctors to hone their skills to be able to slip their alterations by the grade monkeys at these TPGs. Why? Because of the $$$ that some cards can bring in a high grade.