PSA versus SGC

[CardMD]

These were cracked out because I thought psa graded other companies slabs harsher. I wanted what I thought was an unbiased opinion.

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[bobbyw8469]

Like someone else said, SGC was EXTREMELY generous giving the Lajoie a '5' with the staining it had. The Waddell is a coin flip card.

[1880nonsports]

first card around vg - vg/x and second card about x - generally with either company. Both grade DIFFERENTLY in some key areas and there's a lack of consistency in all the TPG's because of the elements described here on earlier threads ad nauseum. As I have OCD which in my day was the simpler OMG - to me the answer would seem obvious - all my graded cards are graded by the same company - AND - like Pete I look for some basic consistency over the years. I will admit lately I'm a little scared by SCD - it appears they've not held firm on a steady course but not enough evidence for me yet.
In any event, the grade a TPG puts on a card except with the high grade registry graded cards DOESN'T CHANGE the card. It's all about YOUR perception and current/future intent - or when buying/selling to determine a market range.

[Touch'EmAll]

More times than not you lose on crossover from SGC to PSA. Not to say I haven't had some make it, but its rare. You stand a better chance at crack and re-submit, but its a gutsy move - only try with high end for the grade SGC.

Pay a little lower for SGC to begin with, be happy with the lower price, keep it in the SGC slab. Always try to look for high end for the grade SGC. Steer clear of low end for the grade anything SGC or PSA.

Recently I have picked up a few good looking SGC 86's with better than average centering and very strong sharp corners. I may crack and send to PSA when the time strikes me, but they are under $200. cards. If they get a PSA 7, that will be ok, but decent chance of PSA 7.5 or even 8.

I have always wondered - does PSA keep pictures of SGC crossover attempts for their future records? I bet a given card may have been tried multiple times. Or not? Any luck from anyone on the second crossover attempt?

[Luke]

The grading standards that the two companies use right now is just different. An SGC 60 is going to be a PSA 3.5 or 4 in most cases.

People pay more for the same grade in a PSA holder, but it's not just because of the registry or anything else. An average SGC 60 is going to be a much weaker than the average PSA 5 (under current grading standards).

In my opinion it doesn't make one company better than the other, and doesn't mean one of them is making mistakes. They just use slightly different grading scales.

[sniffy5]

PSA has carved out a snobbish marketing ploy that has sadly worked out for them, lending to the impression that they are the standard bearers in the hobby. Their elitist approach has worked, however much I despise it. And despite many mass submitters they have in their pockets. But Bottom lines don't lie...0Until the Feds crack down, which they should have done on the very first, very famous, and knowingly inaccurate submission grade...

[nrm1977]

Originally Posted by sniffy5

PSA has carved out a snobbish marketing ploy that has sadly worked out for them, lending to the impression that they are the standard bearers in the hobby. Their elitist approach has worked, however much I despise it. And despite many mass submitters they have in their pockets. But Bottom lines don't lie...0Until the Feds crack down, which they should have done on the very first, very famous, and knowingly inaccurate submission grade...

Well said my friend. A company "founded" on knowingly grading a altered t206 Wagner. Way too much faith put into the almighty PSA! I have yet to ever submit a card to PSA, Yes, I've bought PSA graded cards. I've only ever submitted 13 cards which was to Beckett this past May after 29/30 years of collecting. I'm a collector not a flipper. I'll let my 401k and "real investments" make/lose me money.

With that said, I'm strongly considering using SGC services to preserve my collection. I actually like SGC's cases the best. The black insert really highlights the card. From looking at my SGC cards I've bought , they seem to have a solid grading system. I feel PSA's is all over the place. Heck, look at some PSA cards that where graded 10 years ago. If you were to crack that "older" slabbed PSA card out and send it back in for grading, you'd probably end up with a card 1 to 2 grades lower than the original. Ahh, I miss the old days of , Mint, Near Mint, EX, Good, Poor.

EDIT: I wish someone would come up with a computer program that could "grade" cards, check for alterations, etc etc, this would definatley end the "bias" and "funny business" with these grading companies. Unfortunately it won't be me as I'm in the medical field.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by nrm1977

Well said my friend. A company "founded" on knowingly grading a altered t206 Wagner. Way too much faith put into the almighty PSA! I have yet to ever submit a card to PSA, Yes, I've bought PSA graded cards. I've only ever submitted 13 cards which was to Beckett this past May after 29/30 years of collecting. I'm a collector not a flipper. I'll let my 401k and "real investments" make/lose me money.

With that said, I'm strongly considering using SGC services to preserve my collection. I actually like SGC's cases the best. The black insert really highlights the card. From looking at my SGC cards I've bought , they seem to have a solid grading system. I feel PSA's is all over the place. Heck, look at some PSA cards that where graded 10 years ago. If you were to crack that "older" slabbed PSA card out and send it back in for grading, you'd probably end up with a card 1 to 2 grades lower than the original. Ahh, I miss the old days of , Mint, Near Mint, EX, Good, Poor.

yup...i totally agree but apparently we're in the minority?

[Leon]

Interesting take. Personally I think they Feds have done a pretty good job.

Originally Posted by sniffy5

PSA has carved out a snobbish marketing ploy that has sadly worked out for them, lending to the impression that they are the standard bearers in the hobby. Their elitist approach has worked, however much I despise it. And despite many mass submitters they have in their pockets. But Bottom lines don't lie...0Until the Feds crack down, which they should have done on the very first, very famous, and knowingly inaccurate submission grade...

[Dan Carson]

I think there both inconsistent and should be out sourced right away!

[orly57]

Originally Posted by LukeLyon

The grading standards that the two companies use right now is just different. An SGC 60 is going to be a PSA 3.5 or 4 in most cases.

People pay more for the same grade in a PSA holder, but it's not just because of the registry or anything else. An average SGC 60 is going to be a much weaker than the average PSA 5 (under current grading standards).

In my opinion it doesn't make one company better than the other, and doesn't mean one of them is making mistakes. They just use slightly different grading scales.

I respectfully disagree. SGC can be impossibly tough. This idea that an sgc card will be graded lower by psa is not necessarily true. It is true on crossovers, where they arrogantly and methodically grade it liwer or cry "trimmed" in efforts to belittle the competition. Here is my ruth sgc 4 on the right and a psa 5 on the left. And before you ask, the back on my 4 is CLEAN

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by orly57

I respectfully disagree. SGC can be impossibly tough. This idea that an sgc card will be graded lower by psa is not necessarily true. It is true on crossovers, where they arrogantly and methodically grade it liwer or cry "trimmed" in efforts to belittle the competition. Here is my ruth sgc 4 on the right and a psa 5 on the left. And before you ask, the back on my 4 is CLEAN

The PSA in the above scan is one of the really old labels. That opens up a whole 'nother debate. Treat the old labels (from BOTH companies) with a grain of salt.

[vintagetoppsguy]

I mentioned it in another thread, but I think it's worth mentioning here too. Here are 2 1965 Topps Pete Rose cards that ended on eBay about the same time. Both are graded NM. Does anybody truly believe that the PSA card (in the new holder, with the new flip) is NM?

[Dippydub]

Hey everyone, new to this and thought this might be a good thread to ask the question, since i can't even seem to figure out how to start a new thread!

I'm new to grading and looking a different services (PSA SGC, BGS). What i'm confused about is how you pay for the "level", If you don't know the value of a card.

Lets assume i going with PSA, here are my questions for them:

1. There are a lot of fakes as well as reprints. If the card appears to be in great condition (i.e. grade 7+) how do you submit the value of the card when you aren’t even sure if it’s even a legitimate card? (That's the whole point in sending it in).

2. If you submit a rough estimate of, say grade 8 for example, and put a value down of $1500, which costs you $45 to submit, but the card comes back graded as a 9+ and is actually valued at $6k, would you get charged the higher fee of $250, which is what it would have cost to submit a card at that value tier? Subsequently if it grades out lower or as a fake/reprint, would you get charged the lowest fee of $18?

I’m trying to understand how spending about $200 getting two cards graded, that could turn out to be a fake or reprint, would be worth it if you don’t get a reduced cost.


Sorry for the long post. Any info is GREATLY appreciated.

[bnorth]

The price you use when submitting the card is the raw replacement value. At least that is what I do.

[Dippydub]

Thank you to everyone's help. I understand the process now. Just wish they explained it as well as you guys did on their websites!

[x2drich2000]

Hello Dibbydub,

First off, welcome to the board! You've found a great place to ask questions. If you are not sure if a prewar card is authentic or not, I would first suggest just posting a scan of the card here. You'll get good feedback and could save yourself quite a few bucks. As far as what level to submit the card under, I would underestimate what you think the card will grade at, especially since this is your first time submitting. Think of it more as what you would want to replace the card. If you get lucky enough to get a higher grade than expected and the value increases exponentially as a result, you should be happy to pay the higher fee if they charge you for it. Along the same lines, be happy when you pay more taxes, it just means you made more money.

DJ

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by x2drich2000

If you are not sure if a prewar card is authentic or not, I would first suggest just posting a scan of the card here.

Yes, this.

And if it's a postwar card, just post on the postwar side for opinions.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Dippydub

Hey everyone, new to this and thought this might be a good thread to ask the question, since i can't even seem to figure out how to start a new thread!

I'm new to grading and looking a different services (PSA SGC, BGS). What i'm confused about is how you pay for the "level", If you don't know the value of a card.

Lets assume i going with PSA, here are my questions for them:

1. There are a lot of fakes as well as reprints. If the card appears to be in great condition (i.e. grade 7+) how do you submit the value of the card when you aren’t even sure if it’s even a legitimate card? (That's the whole point in sending it in).

2. If you submit a rough estimate of, say grade 8 for example, and put a value down of $1500, which costs you $45 to submit, but the card comes back graded as a 9+ and is actually valued at $6k, would you get charged the higher fee of $250, which is what it would have cost to submit a card at that value tier? Subsequently if it grades out lower or as a fake/reprint, would you get charged the lowest fee of $18?

I’m trying to understand how spending about $200 getting two cards graded, that could turn out to be a fake or reprint, would be worth it if you don’t get a reduced cost.


Sorry for the long post. Any info is GREATLY appreciated.

People misunderstand this subject a LOT. You are supposed to be declaring the amount you would want to be made whole if the card were lost or somehow damaged. This declaration is for insurance purposes when in the possession of PSA.

Mind you if you radically under-declare you will get contacted explaining that you can't circumvent their fees that way, but why would you want to take that risk in the first place.

What you AREN'T trying to do is predict the future value after grading.