NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. When you click on links to eBay on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
T206s on eBay
Babe Ruth Cards on eBay
t206 Ty Cobb on eBay
Ty Cobb Cards on eBay
Lou Gehrig Cards on eBay
Baseball T201-T217 on eBay
Baseball E90-E107 on eBay
T205 Cards on eBay
Baseball Postcards on eBay
Goudey Cards on eBay
Baseball Memorabilia on eBay
Baseball Exhibit Cards on eBay
Baseball Strip Cards on eBay
Baseball Baking Cards on eBay
Sporting News Cards on eBay
Play Ball Cards on eBay
Joe DiMaggio Cards on eBay
Mickey Mantle Cards on eBay
Bowman 1951-1955 on eBay
Football Cards on eBay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Postwar Sportscard Forums > Postwar Baseball Cards Forum (Pre-1980)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-07-2016, 10:29 AM
the 'stache's Avatar
the 'stache the 'stache is offline
Bill Gregory
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Flower Mound, Texas
Posts: 3,920
Default

I understand your point. But Lou, don't you understand why Brett's numbers should be better? He played one of the premium offensive positions in baseball. Third base. First base. Left field. Right field. When WAR is measured, adjustments are made for second basemen, shortstops, catchers and center fielders, because typically, players at those positions won't generate anywhere near the same kind of offense the corner outfielders, third and first basemen will. Those guys are typically bigger, and slower. Shortstop is the most demanding defensive position on the field. When you plug a guy like Yount, as great as he was defensively, and then turn him into a wrecking ball with the bat, that's much more beneficial to a team than a third baseman that can hit. Because shortstop is the toughest spot on the field to fill; find a great defensive shortstop that can hit like Yount, Ripken, Trammell, and you've really got something. Now, granted, Brett was an exceptional hitter (and one of my favorite players growing up). And he was a real good defender, too. But Yount? Look at his prime before being forced to switch to center field because of his shoulder injury.

Between 1980 and 1984, five seasons, these are his 162 game averages as a shortstop:

.303 AVG, 117 runs scored, 197 hits, 42 doubles, 11 triples, 22 home runs, 15 stolen bases, 95 RBIs. He slashed .355/.498/.854 with a 139 OPS +. For that era, that's obscene production from a shortstop.

Yount had multiple shoulder surgeries after the 1984 season. Then, after basically re-learning how to hit in the 1985 season, altering his swing mechanics in the process, he had another great four year run as a center fielder. Much of his power had been robbed from him, but his 162 game averages in center, another premium defensive position, are quite good:

.312 AVG, 98 runs scored, 195 hits, 35 doubles, 10 triples, 17 home runs, 20 stolen bases, 90 RBI. He slashed .381/.477/.858 between 1986 and 1989.

By win shares, as of 2006, Bill James ranked the different historical players. He had George Brett as the second best third baseman of all-time (behind Mike Schmidt), and Robin Yount as the third best shortstop of all-time (though, I expect Alex Rodriguez may have passed him, depending on when he made the move to third base. Win shares is, of course, just one way of comparing players from different positions, and different eras. I don't mean to infer that win shares is the definitive metric. But I can't think of many shortstops who were better overall than Yount. Wagner, of course, and Cal Ripken Jr was just as good, and did it longer. Mr. Cub? He hit 512 home runs to Yount's 251. Interestingly enough, though, with all that power, his OPS + lead isn't that big: 122 to 115. Ernie was no slouch with the glove, either. He had some real good defensive seasons, and won a Gold Glove. They're close.

It certainly makes for a fun discussion, if you ask me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KCRfan1 View Post
I don't really get too much into Saber metrics like WAR, JAWS, OARS, PAWS ect. Just looking at the basics like you find on the back of a card, Brett clearly has the better stats.

Not taking anything away from Yount.

The 75 set is one of the best for rookie cards with Yount, Carter, Brett, and Rice. Brett and Yount are the 2 to have and can't really go wrong with either. In the Era of free agency and shuffling of player's between teams, it was nice to have those 2 stay with their teams throughout their career. Rice as well.
__________________
Building these sets: T206, 1953 Bowman Color, 1975 Topps.

Great transactions with: piedmont150, Cardboard Junkie, z28jd, t206blogcom, tinkertoeverstochance, trobba, Texxxx, marcdelpercio, t206hound, zachs, tolstoi, IronHorse 2130, AndyG09, BBT206, jtschantz, lug-nut, leaflover, Abravefan11, mpemulis, btcarfagno, BlueSky, and Frankbmd.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-07-2016, 12:05 PM
KCRfan1 KCRfan1 is offline
Lou Simcoe
L0u Sim.coe
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Olathe KS
Posts: 1,718
Default

Rock and Roll Bill!!! I love it! Yount is VERY under appreciated IMO and certainly overlooked in almost every discussion when the Hall comes up.
__________________
My new found obsession the t206!
Reply With Quote
Reply




Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cut junk era commons = most iconic cards ever TimCarrollArt Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 443 11-18-2024 09:47 PM
Iconic Auctions dirdigger Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 2 05-20-2016 05:05 PM
Cut junk era commons = most iconic cards ever TimCarrollArt Net54baseball Sports (Primarily) Vintage Memorabilia Forum incl. Game Used 6 11-16-2015 09:51 AM
Iconic PreWar cards I love to HATE Stonepony Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 27 01-09-2015 06:29 AM
Iconic non Rookie Cards bn2cardz Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 30 09-19-2014 10:59 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:23 AM.


ebay GSB