Proposed Change to Lessen Manipulative Bidding/Conversation with PWCC/Input Wanted

[griffon512]

i know they are difficult to distinguish...moby dick being a 5 page book.

[begsu1013]

Originally Posted by griffon512

i know they are difficult to distinguish...moby dick being a 5 page book.

o whale.

[mechanicalman]

I would rather read James' lengthy, but well-articulated thoughts that actually propose a solution instead of another pithy post whining about high BIN prices. I'd also rather read these posts than my own posts arguing with some dude in the BST.

To the OP's original position, I agree that banning those with a high retraction rate would be a positive first step, but I also agree that there are other forces at play driving prices beyond serial retractors.

[begsu1013]

anything concrete on these other forces?

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by begsu1013

anything concrete on these other forces?

You're reading too much into my comment, Bob. "Market forces" are not inherently illegal or nefarious. I think the primary force at work is that there are simply a lot more deep-pocketed dudes entering the hobby willing to spend more on certain cards. I've spoken with some hobbyists/investors who believe in protecting their investments, but as long as they bid cleanly, do not collude, and pay when they win, I see nothing wrong with it. I have no evidence, and am highly doubtful of, an organized global conspiracy to drive the price of uncentered Pete Rose rookies. But then again, I'm not looking too hard for evidence, so who knows?

[begsu1013]

i get it and i wasnt being negative in asking for anything concrete. but understand how it comes off like that considering recent events and threads.

and great overall answer and synopsis as well.

[scotgreb]

I would suggest a more draconian approach to dealing with retractions. That is, when an eBay user retracts a bid, all of his open bids are canceled and he is blocked from bidding for 10 days.

[mechanicalman]

All good, Bob. My point needed clarification. Definitely some passionate points of view from folks on the topic. The only thing of which I'm 100% certain is that I'll be focused on pre-war for the foreseeable future!

[Rookiemonster]

I don't bid more then what I feel what the card is worth. After that I assume everyone else is a bafoon lol. After it reached its value point I don't even watch the card anymore ( unless it's do sharts and giggles). I really don't care what happens after that.

[JustinD]

It admittedly has been many years since I sold personally on Ebay, I left due to the prevalence of returns for buyer's remorse, NBP's and the inability to leave negative feedback for buyers.

In the past when placing an auction the seller could set a minimum feedback for bidders, Block buyer's with recent neg's and also (I believe) block NPB's.

If Ebay still has those settings forgive me, but I think offering the option to block bidders who withdrew more than one bid int the past 30 days, or had any NPB's. Withdrawals should also require the permission of the seller and if not given, the bidder should be forced to NPB and risk a ban for the "error".

These would be a boon to both sellers and bidders and a win-win. Also blocking anyone with a feedback less than 10, with the ability to email the seller for permission to bid.

Blocking people with Neg's means nothing now if you can't leave a negative for anyone.

As they are unlikely to do this, it is left on the shoulders of responsible sellers. It is easy for them to block a shill account once identified, but the shill will just make another. It's a difficult thing to resolve when Ebay wants no part of it.

[sbfinley]

Honestly, I think more bids are retracted to scare bidders off an item than there are to inflate a hammer price. It's not spoke of as much as shill bidding, but yes plenty of people have alternate accounts just to bid and retract multiple times to thin the buyer pool. I've argue before, as many have, bid your max and forget about the rest. To me it's not worth losing sleep over if I overpaid by 20% on a baseball card. To some it is, and they'll believe to the end it's bad for the hobby. It's no different than someone's political affiliation. Those that believe it's a minor nuisance will likely always believe that and those believe it's systemic cancer will also always hold that point of view. EBay isn't going to change their business model in a way that negatively affect their bottom line and an upstart competitor can't take their business without massive capital, at which point it would more than likely be eBay 2.0. I'm interested to hear Brent changes, but based upon the setup site he uses, it can likely only stunt the problem.

[begsu1013]

i like the way steven thinks.

the retractions, at least some of the time, are done to have the opposite effect....to keep the prices down. not to inflate them, but still could be guised as "price manipulation".

they've simply tricked you into not bidding on the item due to your solid stance about not participating in a "shilled" auction. no more, no less.