PWCC Juggernaught

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by botn

Problem is that as a bidder you do not know if the people you are bidding against are engaged in spirited bidding or if they are simply protecting their consignments or trying to establish significantly higher market values. Getting an item for less than you are willing to pay is great but that is not always necessary for all purchases to be worthwhile.

That is true. I tend to post comments on these type of threads that are pro-pwcc because I feel he is unfairly singled out. This type of activity most likely takes place at every major auction house and in auctions from most if not all ebay sellers who accept consignments. Heritage states they shill their own auctions in their terms and conditions. I wouldn't be surprised to find out this is the case with others. I don't remember many other AH owners discussing shilling and what they try to do to stop it, other than Brent, and I feel he does deserve some credit for that at least.

[botn]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

That is true. I tend to post comments on these type of threads that are pro-pwcc because I feel he is unfairly singled out. This type of activity most likely takes place at every major auction house and in auctions from most if not all ebay sellers who accept consignments. Heritage states they shill their own auctions in their terms and conditions. I wouldn't be surprised to find out this is the case with others. I don't remember many other AH owners discussing shilling and what they try to do to stop it, other than Brent, and I feel he does deserve some credit for that at least.

Many houses have caught a great deal of flack here over the years when record prices were being achieved over and over. Those raising the issue did so simply based on the final price of the auctions and had nothing else to go on.

There is far more for us to see with auctions conducted on eBay, in spite of ebay putting bidders at a great disadvantage by blocking IDs and removing the ability to search the buying history of a user. PWCC is also not the only eBay consignment seller who has been questioned either.

[pokerplyr80]

I think we're all in agreement it would be nice if all ebay sellers and auction houses would do more to prevent shilling and market manipulation.

As to Jake's comment on the Clemente I'm certainly glad no one took me up on the offer here. Although it appears I may have sold it a day two soon based on the PWCC 7 and the one that's up at Heritage now. Still I can't complain, I was very happy with what I got at the time it sold.

[Mdmtx]

I have no idea one way or another about pwcc, so I am not commenting on their merit. However there seems to be some opinion that he is too big to manage his business. With that mentality the big chain fast food places should not be accountable if they sold horse burgers with ground up glass in them? A person is ALWAYS responsible for that which they represent

Mark Medlin

[Stonepony]

Originally Posted by Mdmtx

I have no idea one way or another about pwcc, so I am not commenting on their merit. However there seems to be some opinion that he is too big to manage his business. With that mentality the big chain fast food places should not be accountable if they sold horse burgers with ground up glass in them? A person is ALWAYS responsible for that which they represent

Mark Medlin

I agree. The " too many items to follow" argument doesn't fly with me. You are either a conscientious, ethical and diligent business or you're not.

[ZernialFan]

Here's my two cents on PWCC. That was my T206 Southern League sub-set break up that was just sold on PWCC. Most were Old Mill Backs. I did not post the sub-set on Net54 but offered to a couple people and a local guy near me. I even offered to one guy at a small loss to what I had in it. Seems most want you to give it away. Took the risk and gave to PWCC and was pleased at the results. No really big $ cards, but big to me in total. I did not not bid on any of my cards nor did any of my friends. Some sold for more than I had in them and some sold for less. In the end it came out on the plus side enough to cover the fee and leave me with a small profit. It was fun putting together, but time to sell considering I'm in the process of buying a house. If you consider that PWCC's price in total for the sub-set could be close to "Market Price" than the others that it was offered could have had it at a bargain. I can understand shill bidding on 1 card like a Mantle or Cobb, but it is hard to believe Brent can handle a big stable of people shill bidding on all the quantity of cards he handles month to month. Sorry for the long...........but there were bargains on some that I lost $.

Thanks for reading,
Charlie

[Mdmtx]

To further my post above, if you truly want to make certain there are absolutely no improprieties then cost is involved. Additional staff and procedures. These would drive the cost up and result in higher fees and likely less material offered to sell due to the decreased net return. We can't have our cake and eat it too. If you want a stream lined organization that has a low cost structure and gets material out of the woodwork then you will have the risk of being shilled. If you want to remove all risk then cost could increase due to less available items on the market.

I am in no way condoning shilling nor am I condemning it. It is a fact of life. The best way is to set a price you are willing to pay for an item and don't breach that threshold. Period.

If you compare other industries that have setup regulations to avoid graft, it is almost always at a cost. I don't believe this is a problem we can ever solve globally due to personal greed. I am a firm believer the only thing you can do is to manage your own affairs and have the personal wherewithal to stay within your limits.

Mark Medlin

[Leon]

Sounds like you did ok, had fun, and came out fine with PWCC. Thanks for the update. There is no doubt most of ebay auctions are ok (to me) but there is also a lot of nefarious activity going on too. It's sort of a mine field but it's also a good time to be in the hobby!!

Originally Posted by ZernialFan

Here's my two cents on PWCC. That was my T206 Southern League sub-set break up that was just sold on PWCC. Most were Old Mill Backs. I did not post the sub-set on Net54 but offered to a couple people and a local guy near me. I even offered to one guy at a small loss to what I had in it. Seems most want you to give it away. Took the risk and gave to PWCC and was pleased at the results. No really big $ cards, but big to me in total. I did not not bid on any of my cards nor did any of my friends. Some sold for more than I had in them and some sold for less. In the end it came out on the plus side enough to cover the fee and leave me with a small profit. It was fun putting together, but time to sell considering I'm in the process of buying a house. If you consider that PWCC's price in total for the sub-set could be close to "Market Price" than the others that it was offered could have had it at a bargain. I can understand shill bidding on 1 card like a Mantle or Cobb, but it is hard to believe Brent can handle a big stable of people shill bidding on all the quantity of cards he handles month to month. Sorry for the long...........but there were bargains on some that I lost $.

Thanks for reading,
Charlie