Knute Rockne's playing days

[TanksAndSpartans]

I may have to talk to Bob about a commission as I continue to advertise GridIron Greats This is my last post for the Winter 2015 issue. It includes an article by Jeff entitled "1916 Canton Bulldogs: A Push For A Championship - Part I". And I knew the visuals in the article looked familiar, so I had to dig up this thread.

Jeff, on the PSA set registry, in the write-up for my 35 Rockne, I mention that Rockne played on the 1915 Massillon Tigers Championship Team. Now when I look back at my original post, I mention a tie, so I guess the Tigers never won an outright title with Rockne, so maybe I was liberal in giving him credit for that one. What do you think? Naming a champion is always somewhat subjective in the pre-league days and without a playoff, I guess it didn't really get cleaned up until 32. Great article - looking forward to Part II.

[jefferyepayne]

Glad you liked it, John! As I mention in the article, the "champs" in the Ohio League were always based on public opinion which means sometimes there was no clear cut champ. In particular, the Youngstown Patricians are often cited as the champs in 1915 because they had the best record of the Ohio teams that were considered at the highest level of play. However, the Patricians did not play either Massillon or Canton that year! Massillon and Canton split their two games and also each lost to another team.

Patricians 8 - 0 - 1
Canton 5 - 2
Massillon 5 - 2

public opinion was split between these three teams. Fans of the Patricians argued that they were undefeated and beat the Washington Vigilantes who were often considered a top notch non-Ohio team. Canton won the last game against Massillon and when teams split, it was generally thought that the team who won the second game won the season series. HOWEVER, the Canton win in that second game was highly controversial. That is a whole other story.

jeff

[revmoran]

Another good book on this is The Sunday Game by Keith McClellan - he says Rockne played pro ball for the Akron Indians in 1914, the Massillon Tigers 1915-1917, and the Fort Wayne Friars 1916-1917. Rockne's favorable view of pro football made him an outcast when he coached Notre Dame, which combined with anti-Catholic bias, kept them off the schedule of many other schools and forced them to travel great distances to find opponents. Likewise West Point was outcast because some of their players had already completed four years of football at other colleges before going to West Point. These two outcasts joined forces for one of the most popular of all college rivalries.

[TanksAndSpartans]

Thanks Jeff - wow the Youngstown Patricians - there's a team I really wouldn't have known was in the mix with the two power houses.

Mike, thanks for the great info, another book to add to my reading list.

Jeff, the photos on the cover of the pamphlet... those look an awful lot like football cards - in fact I've seen that same design before (58 Topps comes to mind), but their not stuck to the pamphlet cover, right?

[jefferyepayne]

Originally Posted by DezHood

Jeff, the photos on the cover of the pamphlet... those look an awful lot like football cards - in fact I've seen that same design before (58 Topps comes to mind), but their not stuck to the pamphlet cover, right?

It's not a pamphlet, John. It's a composite piece put together to commemorate the Bulldogs in 1916. Those are original photos attached to the composite. if you look at the Thorpe you will see the raised edge along the left side.

I was kidding around with another collector after I bought this piece that I should cut it up and make a 1916 Canton Bulldogs card set for the registry when it struck me that doing an article that included info on each of the players and cropping out their individual "cards" to show would be really cool. That's how I started working on the article that's in GG now.

jeff

[TanksAndSpartans]

Thanks Jeff - I get it now.

[TanksAndSpartans]

Jeff, nice job finishing up part II of the 16 Bulldogs article - my favorite part was when you documented Thorpe's 71 yd punt return TD.

On a related note, the new GG has more articles then I ever remember - good to see it going strong as I've noticed Coffin Corner has been a little light recently. Are you expected to churn out an article ever issue since you're a contributor?

[Duluth Eskimo]

That composite is incredible