HOF results

[kmac32]

Originally Posted by paul

Griffey and Piazza were elected. Griffey set a new record with 99% of the votes, breaking the record held by Tom Seaver. As a lifelong Seaver fan, I'm saddened.

Griffey was a great player but he was no Tom Seaver when it comes to HOF players. Of course they weren't apples to apples as on was a pitcher and the other an outfielder so I guess there were other criteria to be evaluated.

[JoeyFarino]

Originally Posted by kmac32

Griffey was a great player but he was no Tom Seaver when it comes to HOF players. Of course they weren't apples to apples as on was a pitcher and the other an outfielder so I guess there were other criteria to be evaluated.

Ken Griffey Jr is right up there with seaver.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by JoeyFarino

Ken Griffey Jr is right up there with seaver.

I would say not quite. Seaver is a top 10 all time pitcher. Griffey is probably more in the top 25 than top 10 tier.

[Vintageclout]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I would say not quite. Seaver is a top 10 all time pitcher. Griffey is probably more in the top 25 than top 10 tier.

Peter - Seaver is top 7 WAR & JAWS with a "cheater" (Clemens) and two 19th century pitchers (Kid Nichols & Cy Young for half a career) rated above him. Thus, a top 4/5 pitcher of all time which Griffey cannot nearly boast among position players. Not taking anything away from Junior because he is one of my all-time favorites, but on a comparable basis, not as highly ranked as Tom Terrific.

JoeT

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Vintageclout

Peter - Seaver is top 7 WAR & JAWS with a "cheater" (Clemens) and two 19th century pitchers (Kid Nichols & Cy Young for half a career) rated above him. Thus, a top 4/5 pitcher of all time which Griffey cannot nearly boast among position players. Not taking anything away from Junior because he is one of my all-time favorites, but on a comparable basis, not as highly ranked as Tom Terrific.

JoeT

Exactly. Now if Junior didn't get hurt, who knows, but we can't rate guys on what might have been. It always amuses me to hear people who say Ryan was better than Seaver. Not.

[Vintageclout]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Exactly. Now if Junior didn't get hurt, who knows, but we can't rate guys on what might have been. It always amuses me to hear people who say Ryan was better than Seaver. Not.

LOL - I totally agree....not even close Peter. Nolan Ryan was NEVER the equal of Tom Seaver. Post WWII, Combination peak value and career, only Maddux and Randy Johnson rate with Seaver. Pedro Martinez doesn't have the same longevity, Koufax was a 4/5 year pitcher and Clemens was a cheater. Here's a Seaver stat that is absolutely remarkable. Over the first 15 consecutive seasons of his career, Seaver posted a 2.62 ERA, an incredible feat considering he averaged approximately 252 IP per season over that span!

[Peter_Spaeth]

Yeah, Reggie really said it best, didn't he.

[kamikidEFFL]

I think to many people get into the hof. Let's be honest I mean players who were good not great seem to always squeak in. I think it's overrated the hof now. I say you have 3 ballots to get in and if by then u don't well sorry you don't get in. Plain and simple.

[53Browns]

But speaking of Griffey Jr., IMHO it's a real shame that a century player like that had all of his early baseball cards created in a crap time of mass production. If he had played 100+ years ago can you imagine what a T206 high grade Griffey would go for?

[kmac32]

Originally Posted by JoeyFarino

Ken Griffey Jr is right up there with seaver.

Did not say that Griffey didn't belong in the Hall of Fame. What I basically said is that in his era, Seaver was in a league of his own. In the Griffey era, there were quite a few guys that could hit the ball and field so when you look at his peers, he was awesome but some other players had almost as much value. Also keep in mind that many of Griffey's peers were steroid users so it is harder to judge his class of position players. Seaver did not come from the steroid era so talent was easier to judge.

[AddieJoss]

Anyone have thoughts in Mussina jumping up in the voting to 43%? Think he eventually gets there?

[kmac32]

Originally Posted by AddieJoss

Anyone have thoughts in Mussina jumping up in the voting to 43%? Think he eventually gets there?

Lee Smith started there and his % has not change much and even declined a little. Great player but with the way HOF voters do things, I doubt if he will.

[AddieJoss]

Originally Posted by kmac32

Lee Smith started there and his % has not change much and even declined a little. Great player but with the way HOF voters do things, I doubt if he will.

Mussina has been increasing each year on the ballot....and has a bunch of gold gloves to go with his pitching stats.