The Wentz Bros. Open Their Vault

[bigfish]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

The auction says it was graded by GAI in 2002, right after the company started. That's as good as any PSA or SGC certification in my opinion.

Why not switch it to a reputable company?????

[ksabet]

GAI was reputable in their inception years

[iwantitiwinit]

Originally Posted by ksabet

GAI was reputable in their inception years

whether or not GAI was reputable early on or not seems immaterial to me. Fact is they are not perceived to be as reputable as PSA or SGC is now. Given that, it makes no sense whatsoever to keep a card in a GAI holder if it is up for auction unless there is some question as to the validity of the grade. If the grade is believed to be accurate then it should be submitted for PSA or SGC grading as it will realize more than if it remains in a GAI holder.

[JasonD08]

The card is real. I do not think the flip is relevant to the fat this is a rare combo back Cobb. Whoever purchases this card will only care about authenticity not whether it is an old GAI 6.5 flip or PSA 6 flip. I do not think these guys have a preference with certain companies. How many EXMT UZIT Cobbs are even in the hobby?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by iwantitiwinit

whether or not GAI was reputable early on or not seems immaterial to me. Fact is they are not perceived to be as reputable as PSA or SGC is now. Given that, it makes no sense whatsoever to keep a card in a GAI holder if it is up for auction unless there is some question as to the validity of the grade. If the grade is believed to be accurate then it should be submitted for PSA or SGC grading as it will realize more than if it remains in a GAI holder.

I am sure Brian and Michael will appreciate the advice.

[ullmandds]

that cobb looks pretty good to me...atleast from an "I don't think it's trimmed" perspective. But what is the deal with missing "Detroit" text?

[ALR-bishop]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I am sure Brian and Michael will appreciate the advice.

Agree Peter, they are likely pondering it even now

[Cozumeleno]

Originally Posted by iwantitiwinit

whether or not GAI was reputable early on or not seems immaterial to me. Fact is they are not perceived to be as reputable as PSA or SGC is now. Given that, it makes no sense whatsoever to keep a card in a GAI holder if it is up for auction unless there is some question as to the validity of the grade. If the grade is believed to be accurate then it should be submitted for PSA or SGC grading as it will realize more than if it remains in a GAI holder.

That's sort of how I feel about it to tell you the truth. This is more about the need to sell it later than anything else for me. As reputable as GAI may have been, the reality is that prospective buyers will for the most part trust the PSA or SGC name. There are some that won't touch GAI cards - legit or not ... and that's especially true when you're talking six figures for a card.

[Steve D]

Just positing here, but, the back of the flip indicates the card is from the Copeland Collection. If the card was crossed over, would SGC or PSA keep the Copeland Collection pedigree on it? If they would not, perhaps that is the reason it is still in the GAI holder.

Steve

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Steve D

Just positing here, but, the back of the flip indicates the card is from the Copeland Collection. If the card was crossed over, would SGC or PSA keep the Copeland Collection pedegree on it? If they would not, perhaps that is the reason it is still in the GAI holder.

Steve

some would perceive removing the provenance as a benefit!

[Steve D]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

some would perceive removing the provenance as a benefit!

LOL....yea, that is true!

Steve

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

some would perceive removing the provenance as a benefit!

Did Mastro sell it to Copeland?

[bcornell]

Originally Posted by ksabet

GAI was reputable in their inception years

Mike Baker was likely the grader since it was very early on at GAI. It would be easy enough to verify this, as you'd only have to ask him. The card isn't altered, that's pretty obvious.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by ksabet

GAI was reputable in their inception years

As a matter of fact, their cards in high grade brought a slight premium over PSA graded cards when they first came out. Very similar to Beckett when they first came on the scene. For the owners to cross this card, they would obviously have to crack it and then submit it. That takes huge you know what.....

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

As a matter of fact, their cards in high grade brought a slight premium over PSA graded cards when they first came out. Very similar to Beckett when they first came on the scene. For the owners to cross this card, they would obviously have to crack it and then submit it. That takes huge you know what.....

things that first come out and our new and shiny sometimes due better than established things..no big news there....and now means absolutely nothing...its assumed it was attempted to be crossed for the same grade and was denied.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

things that first come out and our new and shiny sometimes due better than established things..no big news there....and now means absolutely nothing...its assumed it was attempted to be crossed for the same grade and was denied.

There is absolutely no way the card will cross unless it's cracked out, especially with PSA. I do agree with Peter in his previous posts, GAI initially was very well thought of, and this card appears to be the real thing. Having said that, it is still in a GAI holder and 99% or better of the high end collectors are not going to chance it, especially at this kind of price. What would the card be worth even as a PSA 6 or 6.5?

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

There is absolutely no way the card will cross unless it's cracked out, especially with PSA. I do agree with Peter in his previous posts, GAI initially was very well thought of, and this card appears to be the real thing. Having said that, it is still in a GAI holder and 99% or better of the high end collectors are not going to chance it, especially at this kind of price. What would the card be worth even as a PSA 6 or 6.5?

there not many of these out there...even if cracked it out I think PSA will know its the same card..

[JasonD08]

Doesn't matter if the card is a PSA 6, PSA 7 or GAI 6.5 or SGC 80 or 84.....it still takes $125K to purchase because it is authentic EXMT.....my guess they do not care about the flip. The card is genuine and there probably is not another one as nice.

Jason

[bcornell]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

There is absolutely no way the card will cross unless it's cracked out, especially with PSA. I do agree with Peter in his previous posts, GAI initially was very well thought of, and this card appears to be the real thing. Having said that, it is still in a GAI holder and 99% or better of the high end collectors are not going to chance it, especially at this kind of price. What would the card be worth even as a PSA 6 or 6.5?

What do you think it would be "worth"? More? Less?

Do you know who graded most vintage cards at PSA before he left to start GAI?

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by bcornell

What do you think it would be "worth"? More? Less?

Do you know who graded most vintage cards at PSA before he left to start GAI?

Do you know who left PSA to start a company that now has the worst reputation and failed?

PSA standards have generally thought to have improved over time as well.....if someone doesn't agree with that than they will agree that PSA recent standards are at least better than 90% of the standards of GAI for the life of that company..