PWCC green cobb psa 5.5 going through the roof

[calvindog]

Leon, first you'd have to promise not to ban me no matter what I say, under any circumstance. I don't want to end up like Rob Dewolf or Wonka (who is still banned while a host of miscreants on Net 54 are members in good standing).

[Leon]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Leon, first you'd have to promise not to ban me no matter what I say, under any circumstance. I don't want to end up like Rob Dewolf or Wonka (who is still banned while a host of miscreants on Net 54 are members in good standing).

Care to answer you defending card doctors while you go after them on the board? And what about the diversions to take the heat off of your client who submitted cards that were fake for grading? And how about your client with the fake Magies..... I am sure you are doing it all for the good of the hobby, right?

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Leon

Care to answer you defending card doctors while you go after them on the board? And what about the diversions to take the heat off of your client who submitted cards that were fake for grading? And how about your client with the fake Magies..... I am sure you are doing it all for the good of the hobby, right?

I know it's not easy to actually debate someone out here when you don't have the ability to ban them. But this is Net 54 and not the real world, so you get to decide who stays and who goes, thus determining how the debates go as well. I'll discuss anything you want to discuss within attorney ethics rules -- as long as you promise not to ban me, no matter what comes out.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by calvindog

I know it's not easy to actually debate someone out here when you don't have the ability to ban them. But this is Net 54 and not the real world, so you get to decide who stays and who goes, thus determining how the debates go as well. I'll discuss anything you want to discuss within attorney ethical rules -- as long as you promise not to ban me, no matter what comes out.

Just answer the questions....

[Stonepony]

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[asphaltman]

Originally Posted by Leon

Just answer the questions....

Jeff I would not take this as a promise to not ban.

[btcarfagno]

Originally Posted by asphaltman

Jeff I would not take this as a promise to not ban.

Tom C

[PolarBear]

[Beastmode]

Originally Posted by Leon

Just answer the questions....

I guess Jeff didn't want to answer the questions and get the immunity stick....off the island?

[Kenny Cole]

Sigh ....

Jeff defends people who are accused because he took an oath to do so. That doesn't mean he condones what they are alleged to have done, nor does it prohibit him from saying that the alleged offense, in general, is wrong. In fact, I might suggest that he is in a better position to lobby against hobby fraud, having been involved in it first hand (in the sense of defending those accused of committing it, not committing it himself) than some others. Maybe he's more vocal because he has more rubber meets the road experience than many others. Don't know, just sayin ....

Leon, you do a great job at a thankless task. Kind of like herding cats. I don't always agree with you, but I generally do. I have friends, not hobby friends but friends in general, who could (probably justifiably) be accused of lots of things, some of which would probably be warranted. Even if convicted, they would still be my friends and I would visit them in prison. I've had to do that a time or two. So I get that dynamic as well.

This is a forum to talk about cards. Mostly, I like to see threads about cards, the history of cards, research about cards, people who are happy to have landed a card they really wanted, and similar topics. I get that fraudsters have to be outed and discussed, but I have to say that it seems as if those types of accusations have been vastly more prevalent in the last few years than they used to be. I view that as a big negative.

It is completely fair for Jeff or anyone else to raise perceived concerns. It is also completely fair for Leon or anyone else to challenge such an allegation. I don't know what the answer is, but I can honestly say that wading through accusations and recriminations over and over again becomes really tiresome and I think that the message which is meant to be sent sometimes gets lost in the noise on both sides. That's not productive.

With some trepidation, I suggest that you add a dedicated complaint area where people who had bad experiences can explain and those who are thinking about buying from someone can look to see if they have been accused, etc. The accused can respond. The virtue is obviously that folks don't have to parse through tons of emails to figure out whether there's an issue because it is hopefully in one place. Sort of like ebay feedback but hopefully better. Just a suggestion.

Kenny

[Mikehealer]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Leon, first you'd have to promise not to ban me no matter what I say, under any circumstance. I don't want to end up like Rob Dewolf or Wonka (who is still banned while a host of miscreants on Net 54 are members in good standing).

Why is Wonka banned? I could understand his posts.

[asoriano]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Leon, first you'd have to promise not to ban me no matter what I say, under any circumstance. I don't want to end up like Rob Dewolf or Wonka (who is still banned while a host of miscreants on Net 54 are members in good standing).

Wonka was banned?