1952 Topps #131-190 Gray Backs

[Brianruns10]

My impression was that the discovery of a 146 House Gray Back Yellow Tiger error pretty much proved that the grays and whites were made at the same time and place, and bolstered the theory that the gray backs simply exist because there was leftover gray card stock that they used up along with the new white stock.

[ALR-bishop]

House aside, the Lemke blog, including his interviews with several long term 52 collectors, also seems to debunk the Canadian theory. But it is not just the card stock that differs. The gray fronts seem significantly different than the cream fronts, and as indicated in the blog, there seem to be two different front versions of the grays. The might at least indicate two different printers or sources.

On the House yellow tiger, it seems to exist in cream and gray. Does someone if that is also true of the version which is yellow but has a red tongue ? And can the yellow or yellow/red version be found with both different front versions of the gray backs ?

[Brianruns10]

And then on top of all that, there is the mystery of just why the Pete Reiser card is so much more scarce than the rest?

And as an aside, that nearly complete set of gray backs for sale on REA (59 out of 60, missing only the Reiser) is up to $12,000 with four days left! I wonder how much it'd be up to if it DID have the Reiser?

[flkersn]

The cream-back House "yellow logo" exists in several levels of purity--from red tongue to pink to less that pink to gone. The two or three gray-back yellow logo Houses I have seen seem to be devoid of red. I assume in the cream-back case, the printer was gradually running out of red ink during the printing process. If the latter is true, then the gray stock was used during the end of the run when the red was gone. It seems like it had to be one printer. How likely is it that two machines ran out of red ink? IF all that is true, it would suggest that the cream stock was used before the gray stock.

Regarding the Reiser, I have not heard any good reason about the shortage. It is certainly possible, but not probable, that this card had a tougher life than others (beat to crap, lost, pasted to scrapbooks, collected by relatives, etc). I think it more likely that there are a bunch out there in raw condition, just waiting for the right time. That is what happened with Maxwell, Rogovin, Post, etc. They are still rare, but several raw ones have appeared in the last year. So, bottom line, I think the Reiser is an artificial shortage that may or may not resolve itself.

BTW, in case anyone has a spare Reiser, I have a PSA 4 gray/yellow House....

Bill

[Laxcat]

I think Bill is right. I believe, from my conversation with my father and a few of his old dealer buddies, that there are quite a few raw ones left out there. I made a find of 14 in the old store stock from the Austin store, mixed in with the regular 52's and still have the San Antonio store stock and "collection" to look through.

[toppcat]

Does anyone know the position of the Reiser on the sheet? Was it a corner card?

[flkersn]

According to Patrick.

This is what I get when I post without checking my notes! It should be DPs versus SPs. Here is the layout:

3rd series:
131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140
141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150
151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160
161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170
171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180

181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190
131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140
141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150
151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160
161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170

Sorry for the confusion.
Patrick