Oldest Memorabilia

[Scott Garner]

I've shown this ticket on net54 before, but here is a very early White Stockings baseball season ticket from 1874.
Condition is pretty remarkable considering age...

[bmarlowe1]

Originally Posted by Scott Garner

I've shown this ticket on net54 before, but here is a very early Chicago White Stockings baseball season ticket from 1874.
Condition is pretty remarkable considering age...

Scott - nice item. I have no expertise in tickets, but are you saying that this is a Chicago White Stockings National Association ticket? Thanks.

[gnaz01]

Mine

[aquarius31]

Originally Posted by gnaz01

Mine

Very nice Greg! As you probably know, this is the earliest woodcut depiction of Cap Anson dating to July 5, 1873.

[gnaz01]

Originally Posted by aquarius31

Very nice Greg! As you probably know, this is the earliest woodcut depiction of Cap Anson dating to July 5, 1873.

Yes, the reason I bought it He looks like a young Matthew Modine

[jpop43]

Here is a great image that a wonderful, CT area photographer took of some of our 19th C. stuff for a calendar he created for 2014...

Two of our lemon peel balls, the presentation bat, a great tin type image, an 1875 program, and the 1860's era belt all made it into this shot.

[Runscott]

I have a few memorabilia pieces older, but this is currently the oldest baseball piece:

[CarltonHendricks]

Here is what I'm pretty sure is my oldest sports antique...an 1838 piece of rowing sheet music...To most it probably doesn't look very exciting...but an 1838 illustration of organized American athletic competition is remarkably rare...And it's pure American...dedicated to all the New York boat clubs...

http://sportsantiques.com/latestacquistions.htm
Below is an excerpt from the page linked above where you can read the whole story of the where when how I found it...you just need to scroll about 80% down the page to get to that part.



http://www.sportsantiques.com/ice_skate_poster.htm
Before I got the sheet music this 1862 ice skate poster advertising poster below was my oldest piece...above is a link to the full feature page.

[Scott Garner]

Delete

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by bmarlowe1

Scott - nice item. I have no expertise in tickets, but are you saying that this is a Chicago White Stockings National Association ticket? Thanks.

Hi Mark,
To the best of my knowledge, I believe it is the White Stockings of the National Association.

From my research, The White Stockings began in 1871, but a fire burned down their original stadium in 1871. They re-entered the league in 1874 and I believe that this ticket originates from this season. On the back of the ticket it also makes reference to the Junior White Stockings and the the Resolutes, which may have played at their ball field as well.

I hope this helps.

[iwantitiwinit]

FToliver1987Topps.JPG

[bobfreedman]

1892 Cleveland Spiders Schedule with Cy Young

[murphusa]

1865 leather wrapped bat and an early Victor Bat

[jpop43]

Some of our early bats...

1. c. 1860s tiger maple baseball bat (36" and presentation quality)
2. c. 1860s -1870s leather handled baseball bat; Both Peck & Snyder, and Ward B. Snyder marketed these bats from the 1860's to around 1875.
3. c. 1860s -1870s presentation/trophy bat

All of our 19th century baseball collection can be viewed on our website...

http://dugouttreasures.com/product.cfm?sID=4

Great thread! Many thanks to Gary for getting it started!

Jonathan
www.dugouttreasures.com

[seattlerainiers]

Not my oldest baseball item, but apropos for the thread:
1885 Chicago White Stocking silver trophy ball that belonged to Billy Sunday.

[GaryPassamonte]

Some great stuff posted. Silver trophy ball-wow! Jonathan- those bats look familiar. I think you'll remember this 1867 Fulton NY trophy ball.

[jpop43]

I do and I LOVE it! Simply wonderful piece.

[bmarlowe1]

Originally Posted by Scott Garner

Hi Mark,
To the best of my knowledge, I believe it is the White Stockings of the National Association.

From my research, The White Stockings began in 1871, but a fire burned down their original stadium in 1871. They re-entered the league in 1874 and I believe that this ticket originates from this season. On the back of the ticket it also makes reference to the Junior White Stockings and the the Resolutes, which may have played at their ball field as well.

I hope this helps.

Well, not really. If this was as claimed, it would be, to say the least, a very significant item. But there is absolutely nothing on the ticket that references Chicago, Illinois, the 23rd Street Grounds (AKA State Street Grounds), or the National Association or even just "Association." The “series of games both junior and senior” could mean anything. There is nothing here to support the contention that “senior” means “National Association.”

Any number of town team could have called themselves the "White Stockings," and team names (often based on hosiery color) were a very fluid thing. Of the two Philadelphia entries in the 1873 NA, one was called the White Stockings (changed to Pearls in 1874).

All you seem to being saying here is that it is an 1874 baseball season ticket (it surely is), the Chicago White Stockings NA club played in 1874 (they surely did), therefore this is a Chicago NA ticket. There are some big logical steps missing.

The signature looks like "H. A. Jackson." Did you find that he had some connection to the Chi NA club?

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by bmarlowe1

Well, not really. If this was as claimed, it would be, to say the least, a very significant item. But there is absolutely nothing on the ticket that references Chicago, Illinois, the 23rd Street Grounds (AKA State Street Grounds), or the National Association or even just "Association." The “series of games both junior and senior” could mean anything. There is nothing here to support the contention that “senior” means “National Association.”

Any number of town team could have called themselves the "White Stockings," and team names (often based on hosiery color) were a very fluid thing. Of the two Philadelphia entries in the 1873 NA, one was called the White Stockings (changed to Pearls in 1874).

All you seem to being saying here is that it is an 1874 baseball season ticket (it surely is), the Chicago White Stockings NA club played in 1874 (they surely did), therefore this is a Chicago NA ticket. There are some big logical steps missing.

The signature looks like "H. A. Jackson." Did you find that he had some connection to the Chi NA club?

Hi Bruce,
FWIW, you may be correct, because the front of the ticket does not state Chicago White Stockings.

FYI, I never was able to nail down the signature on the back when I tried to do some research on it when I bought it from an eBay seller in Illinois (to the best of my recollection) several years ago. In 2010 I did see another one of these season tickets in a catalogue auction, but it was unsigned on the back
There is a book entitled Major League Baseball Expansions and Relocations: A History, 1876-2008 by Frank P. Jozsa, Jr that does make mention of the Resolutes in 1874, but I don't have iron clad proof that the ticket originates from the Chicago White Stockings.

Hell, the ticket is over 140 years old & I just like the damn thing!

Beautiful rarities by the other posters. Congrats to all of you that own these beauties!

[sicollector1954]

Some amazing survivors to say the least….here is my Spalding ring bat…made out of willow and currently weighs only 26 oz. Have it right below an Albert Spalding framed autograph in my sports room.

[WWGjohn]

A couple of 1850's town ball bats and an 1860's bat.

Top bat is 32" long, 30 oz made of hickory.
Middle bat is 32" long, 30 oz.
Bottom bat is 39" long, 36 oz.

John

[bmarlowe1]

Originally Posted by Scott Garner

Hi Bruce [sic],
FWIW, you may be correct,...I don't have iron clad proof that the ticket originates from the Chicago White Stockings...Hell, the ticket is over 140 years old & I just like the damn thing!

I know this thread is intended to be a display of everyone's really nice old stuff, so I thought about this for a while before posting further. But, by my count this is 3rd time you have posted the claim that this is for sure an 1874 NA ticket, which would be to say the least an extremely rare item. I guess it could be considered progress that you are now saying that you don't have "iron clad proof," but that misses the point which is:
there is absolutely no logical reason to think that this is an NA ticket.

[packs]

1868:


[/QUOTE]

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by bmarlowe1

I know this thread is intended to be a display of everyone's really nice old stuff, so I thought about this for a while before posting further. But, by my count this is 3rd time you have posted the claim that this is for sure an 1874 NA ticket, which would be to say the least an extremely rare item. I guess it could be considered progress that you are now saying that you don't have "iron clad proof," but that misses the point which is:
there is absolutely no logical reason to think that this is an NA ticket.

Mark,
This is going to be my last post on this topic as well, and it is as you said, an opportunity to share nice old stuff. I don't want this to get into a pissing contest, because I don't really believe anybody likes that kind of thing. I have always enjoyed your posts on net54 and I have no issue with you personally and I truly believe that you bring value to the net54 forum.

FWIW,I sincerely don't ever recall stating that the ticket is "for sure" a NA ticket. When I purchased it originally, I did believe that it was (at least that was my thought process up until your post).
What I did say when you questioned me about it is that I believed it was from the NA White Stockings "to the best of my knowledge". You made the point that it likely wasn't because of a couple of factors. OK, fine. It's not the first time that I've been wrong and certainly not the last time I'm sure.
It's OK to question a person's perception of reality if you believe that it should be reconsidered & I have.

Please don't make it sound like I have done this through conscious misrepresentation, because it was never intended that way.
Enough said. Peace, out!