PWCC & eBay - help us improve the hobby

[Brian Van Horn]

I hate to pile on, but the Standard Biscuit fiasco in February is still a relevant topic. The cards were faked and still passed through SGC and were then auctioned through PWCC.

[conor912]

Originally Posted by Brian Van Horn

I hate to pile on, but the Standard Biscuit fiasco in February is still a relevant topic. The cards were faked and still passed through SGC and were then auctioned through PWCC.

...but SGC graded them, so they MUST be legit.

[wonkaticket]

Adam are you sure? I was told this isn't in his DNA?

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

Adam are you sure? I was told this isn't in his DNA?

Tax fraud: in his DNA
Fraud rampant in his auctions: in his DNA
Sending out ebay messages openly suggesting to buyers how to beat the tax laws: in his DNA
Lying on Net 54: in his DNA

[wonkaticket]

So Jeff you're saying it should be viewed more like this?

[calvindog]

Lololololololol

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

So Jeff you're saying it should be viewed more like this?

close enough!!!!!

[wonkaticket]

Pete, I agree hard to argue with Lichtman Labs I've used them for years...they have never let me down.

[pokerplyr80]

It sounds like PWCC doesn't have many fans on this forum. I'm sure people who consign to him to try to shill their own auctions, as they do through other sellers and auction houses. Only Brent can say what is really being done to prevent it. But with 1000s of cards up at any time I'm sure it's difficult to monitor.

I don't see how anyone could hold him or any auction house responsible for selling a counterfeit card that was good enough to fool SGC and was encased.

As for the PWCC certified PSA 10 it does sound unusual. However, if it weren't possible to have a PSA 10 that is nice for the grade, there would be no BGS 10 pristine. Perhaps this is one that could be crossed over.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Brian Van Horn

I hate to pile on, but the Standard Biscuit fiasco in February is still a relevant topic. The cards were faked and still passed through SGC and were then auctioned through PWCC.

I don't think we can blame PWCC for accepting SGC graded cards on consignment, unless the consignor was inherently suspicious, but you do raise the very important question of who was able to get these through SGC and how.

For reference:
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=201147

[Exhibitman]

I agree with Peter re the counterfeit cards in SGC holders; no one should expect an auctioneer or consignment seller to second-guess the TPGs.

As for the shilling and fraud admission, first thought I had about the OP was "how stupid was that?" Had a client of mine wanted to make a similar post I'd have told him to STFU because he will win over no one who wasn't already OK with his business and he might step in the doo-doo by accident, as happened here. What leads someone to think they can BS around stuff like that I will never understand. Nixonian hubris? brain lesions? Alien mind control beams?

An interesting thing that got short shrift here is the 2nd PWCC post discussing the inside game with eBay reps. I thought that was fascinating, esp. how eBay might actually change the feedback system to something more transparent, as it used to be. 90% of the shilling crap would end if the system still allowed for the outing and tracking of shill bidders. A return to that standard would be nice and I hope it happens. Or should I just go ahead and cancel that ice skating lesson in Hell?

Frankly, I love the idea of tracked consignor ID's right in the listing. Easily done, and easily checked.

Despite all of the negatives, personally, I have no issue with anyone who chooses to bid with PWCC or Probstein. We're all card sluts to one extent or another. I've danced with those devils more than once, but always eyes wide open and aware of the pitfalls of wading into the cesspool. Anyone who doesn't know what these middlemen are about and act accordingly at this point is akin to someone taking up smoking: it says right on the damned box the stuff is bad for you, so ignore the warnings at your own peril.

Time to move on to other dead horses to beat?

[calvindog]

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...p2047675.l2565

Here is an interesting underbidder on PWCC's auctions: 104 total bids in the past 30 days on 102 items -- and 97 percent of the bids are with PWCC. Gee. If you spend 10 mins perusing PWCC auctions you will find 10 more underbidders just like this one.

[Peter_Spaeth]

And then, there are people who make fake Magie errors and put fake stamps on blank backed cards. What a world, eh?

[Peter_Spaeth]

And in the meantime, these results are pretty hard to believe on 59 Mantles. Then again, the winner of the one that went 50 percent over the prior record price is the underbidder on the PSA 10 Jordan rookie, so he must have money to burn.

Latest Auction Prices for: PSA 8 - Average Price: $2,700.63



6/11/15 eBay Auction | Image pwcc_auctions -***o 44 $4,100.00
5/31/15 eBay Auction | Image pwcc_auctions 6***6 35 $3,105.00
5/29/15 eBay Listing | Image vintagescards s***o BIN $2,695.00 8
5/29/15 eBay Listing | Image vintagescards s***o BIN $2,695.00 8
5/26/15 eBay Auction | Image probstein123 s***i 39 $2,350.00
5/14/15 eBay Auction | Image pwcc_auctions n***a 26 $2,300.71
4/10/15 Greg Bussineau Auction | Image 7 $2,820.00
3/29/15 eBay Auction | Image higradecards10 a***g 18 $2,550.00
1/24/15 eBay Listing | Image buddysbaseball h***7 Best Offer $2,695.00 8
1/24/15 eBay Listing | Image buddysbaseball h***7 Best Offer $2,695.00 8
1/11/15 Memory Lane Auction | Image 9 $1,922.76
1/11/15 Memory Lane Auction | Image 7 $2,815.42
1/9/15 eBay Listing | Image vintagescards 9***n BIN $2,595.00 8
12/16/14 eBay Auction | Image prewarcardcollector 5***f 24 $2,225.00
12/5/14 Greg Bussineau Image 7 $2,100.00

[pokerplyr80]

I'm surprised it went that high since it wasn't even PWCC certified high end

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by calvindog

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...p2047675.l2565

Here is an interesting underbidder on PWCC's auctions: 104 total bids in the past 30 days on 102 items -- and 97 percent of the bids are with PWCC. Gee. If you spend 10 mins perusing PWCC auctions you will find 10 more underbidders just like this one.

That looks more like one of those strange bidders to me. Bidder has feedback of 1649 with only 104 bids last month.

Now this looks more like a shill bidder to me. Only 201 feedback with 547 bids in 30 days on 173 items. Not a PWCC auction jus an example.

Bidder: t***7( 201Feedback score is 100 to 499)
Feedback: 100%Positive
Item description:
Item Title:
Bids on this item: 12

30-Day Summary
Total bids: 547
Items bid on: 173
Bid activity (%) with this seller: 98% Help
Bid retractions: 0
Bid retractions (6 months): 0

[calvindog]

A bidder who bids on 102 items with 104 bids, with 97% of the auctions belonging to PWCC is a shill bidder.

[conor912]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

I agree with Peter re the counterfeit cards in SGC holders; no one should expect an auctioneer or consignment seller to second-guess the TPGs.

I hear what you're saying, but why not? It burns may ass when an AH takes no responsibility for what they're selling. It's a total cop out. They're just slinging these things into auctions without even looking at the card. It's amazing how many people don't even look at the effing card anymore. The flip is all that matters to the AH, period.

Sorry. This is my "two drinks on an empty stomach" rant. Carry on.