Magie cards

calvindog · #1 02-24-2015, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Other than the Wagner being mentioned in the Mastro indictment, and as I understood it that was not the basis for his plea (but I could be wrong), are you aware of any prosecutions for altering CARDS?

They were prosecuted for the Wagner. And there were other allegations for card altering which was part of the evidence against them. As for other cases, how many different federal indictments do you think even exist for fraud in this hobby? Believe it or not, there isn't a "Baseball Card Strike Force" in every US Attorney's Office. For the most part, the frauds aren't big enough for a federal prosecutor to deal with and are not easy to prove. That there have been any federal cases at all surprises a lot of people.

Peter_Spaeth · #2 02-24-2015, 07:13 PM

Your language suggested there had been a reasonable number of total prosecutions.

"Surely there have been more prosecutions based on altered hobby material than shill bidding, not even close."

"Not even close" suggests to me a decent sample size.

But in any event, it is clear that there are no prosecutions for altered cards unless one counts Mastro, which is all I had asked. And I am guessing there aren't going to be any in the future.

So basically, the conspiracy of silence among auction houses dealers major collectors (and maybe even grading services, nothing would surprise me) will continue undeterred, as will rampant card doctoring. So it goes.

calvindog · #3 02-24-2015, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Your language suggested there had been a reasonable number of total prosecutions.

"Surely there have been more prosecutions based on altered hobby material than shill bidding, not even close."

"Not even close" suggests to me a decent sample size.

But in any event, it is clear that there are no prosecutions for altered cards unless one counts Mastro, which is all I had asked. And I am guessing there aren't going to be any in the future.

So basically, the conspiracy of silence among auction houses dealers major collectors (and maybe even grading services, nothing would surprise me) will continue undeterred, as will rampant card doctoring. So it goes.

I think there have been a pretty decent amount of fake game used jersey cases and investigations underway. I also think there may be an altered card case in the works.

Peter_Spaeth · #4 02-24-2015, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by calvindog

I think there have been a pretty decent amount of fake game used jersey cases and investigations underway. I also think there may be an altered card case in the works.

May I see the day. That would be fantastic.

Rollingstone206 · #5 02-24-2015, 10:38 PM

...

drcy · #6 02-24-2015, 11:22 PM

To answer earlier question, there are ways to identify when solvent has been used to remove ink. For example, the Gone With the Stain guy said his autograph removal work is seen under black light.

TexasLeaguer · #7 02-24-2015, 07:26 PM

So who is Gerry Schwartz? Why has nobody jumped in to vouch for him? I mean, if he did it, and everyone including law enforcement is going to turn a blind eye to it, the least we can do is leave a flaming bag of dog poo on his doorstep or something. Has he denied doing it at least?

drcy · #8 02-24-2015, 08:22 PM

As I recall, prosecutors mentioned other alterations with Mastro Auctions. The example(s) I recall involved restoration than wasn't disclosed. It was the lack of disclosure at sale that was the legal issue, because there's nothing illegal about restoration, or even trimming the T206 Honus Wagner, in and of itself.

Peter_Spaeth · #9 06-14-2015, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TexasLeaguer

So who is Gerry Schwartz? Why has nobody jumped in to vouch for him? I mean, if he did it, and everyone including law enforcement is going to turn a blind eye to it, the least we can do is leave a flaming bag of dog poo on his doorstep or something. Has he denied doing it at least?

Bringing this disturbing thread back to see if anyone knows what became of this.

For reference, the original Nash article.
http://haulsofshame.com/blog/?p=27012

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