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#1
01-30-2015, 09:45 AM
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I think anyone who can have a heated discussion with opposing views, on the internet with a complete stranger, and it ends well - should be congratulated. When it involves football, probably moreso. I will say this about Kevin - he's a great guy, and like a lot of people here, you need to spend 30 minutes with him on the phone and you'll understand that. And David and I have beaten each other to pulp before in these discussions, and I have no problems with him either. It takes a lot of time and I think Mike is a much quicker learner than some of the rest of us. Also very glad to hear this about the footballs and the refs - looking forward to the ESPN and NFL Channel analyses today. I really did not like the idea of not liking Brady.
__________________
$co++ Forre$+ 
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#2
01-30-2015, 10:40 AM
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__________________
Now watch what you say, or they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh, fanatical, criminal Won't you sign up your name? We'd like to feel you're acceptable, respectable, presentable, a vegetable If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other.- Ulysses S. Grant, 18th US President.
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#3
01-30-2015, 03:52 PM
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I am truly sorry for the mishap on the teams. I have been following pro football for 40 yrs, and it was just a simple mistake. Had I continued following the thread, I would have known of the mistake and corrected it in another post. I just now saw the last several posts of the thread 10 minutes ago. The only reason why I responded to the thread in the first place was the continuous moaning and groaning of the deflated footballs. Ironically, it was from a guy from Mass. My point was simply that the Patriots would have beaten the Colts no matter what shape the footballs were in. Having said all that, the Patriots should and will be punished strictly if this all proves to be of their knowing intentions....Thanks
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#4
01-30-2015, 07:57 PM
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#5
01-30-2015, 11:26 PM
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What is the point of a log?-- it was a pass/fail test. They noted that 11 balls failed--why note it at all if they did not believe it important? What should they have done--halted the contest, immediately toss a player or coach from the game, declare a forfeit? You can blame it on the media all you want-- seems a lot of ex-players and coaches have commented that they think it is worthy of discussion, criticism, investigation, etc. Then again, they could all be haters.
__________________
Now watch what you say, or they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh, fanatical, criminal Won't you sign up your name? We'd like to feel you're acceptable, respectable, presentable, a vegetable If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other.- Ulysses S. Grant, 18th US President. Last edited by nolemmings; 01-30-2015 at 11:27 PM.
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#6
01-31-2015, 02:33 AM
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Also, do you truly trust all these ex players and coaches to be objective? (and please feel free to provide specific names/examples). I know one of my favorite all time players Jerry Rice said this controversy taints the Pats legacy, and that if they win the SB they deserve an asterisk, blah, blah. I love the Niners, and loved watching him play, but I think his comments were moronic. You can trust his opinions if you want, but this is coming from a guy who played on a team who's O-line coach Bob McKittrick taught players how to leg whip, make it look accidental, and in doing so may have often times severely injured guys while avoiding a flag... from a team who's D-line lathered its jerseys in vasoline so that O-linemen couldn't grasp their shoulder pads while trying to block...from one of the first teams to sow up their jersey sleeves so tacklers had nothing to grab at... and from a team that very possibly bypassed the salary cap and paid players under the table during its 1994 SB run. Jerry Rice himself fumbled 2-3 plays ahead of Terrell Owens' "The Catch II" but so effectively sold that he had not, the ref simply gave the ball back to SF. This just scratches the surface of questionable things done to gain an advantage, and this is in no way unique to the Niners (or Pats). In most cases people either ignore this stuff or call it gamesmanship. I find it hard to believe guys like Rice are mostly speaking out based upon their sense integrity for the game. IMO, Jerry Rice said what he did because he doesn't want the Pats to challenge the Niiners' legacy, and smelled blood in the water. I've heard other Niners interviewed going back to around 2005 talking about not wanting Brady to ever match Montana's 4 SB rings, etc. I've also watched retired '72 Dolphins pop champagne every year when the last undefeated team loses. These guys can be just as petty and jealous as the next guy. I don't hold it against them, but it makes me take a lot of what they say with a grain of salt. Back to the point of game ball air pressure, Steve Young, one of the more intellectual QBs (QB/JD) to ever play the game admitted on radio he never even knew there was a rule for air pressure. Again, it's been a non factor, non issue. I think just about every team in the league will do just about anything within its control (not necessarily within the rules) to create an advantage. I'm not saying this is always the right thing to do, just that it doesn't make the Pats an exception, and it doesn't justify their being singled out so far above and beyond other teams (no one's talking about Brad Johnson's bribing someone to work in SB game balls). If the NFL has strong evidence the Pats cheated, great, punish them and move on. However, even if guilty, IMO this violation is way down the list of violations that occur on a regular basis.
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#7
01-31-2015, 03:32 AM
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Just found this little nugget from 1988... vaseline, stickum, silicone, even Coca Cola. This is a great peak at what the NFL has always been, and what it still is.
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/2...AL.html?pg=all
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#8
01-31-2015, 11:39 AM
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It is incredibly weak to suggest that a league that fines its players for wearing the wrong colored socks, gloves or wrist bands does not take seriously a rule that directly impacts on the fairness of competition. Yes, the NFL could mark each ball with a number before the game, measure the psi and log it, then do the same at halftime. At halftime or after the game they could then preserve any balls that were found to have deflated in a controlled atmosphere and under quarantined conditions, so that any team accused of deflating them could have its “atmospheric” experts come in to perform their own measurements without fear of a “contaminated” environment. Only then can we conclude the league is serious? Actually, all balls will need to be quarantined, including, say, those used by the Indianapolis Colts, none of which lost more than 1.0 psi (if they lost any at all) while nearly all of the Patriots’ balls fell by more than that, so we can listen to people guess, contort and postulate how different handling and other conditions explain away the apparent contradiction. Only then can we conclude that this is a serious rule and that it was violated.
How about just having the footballs delivered by armored truck to the field, where they are measured before all who care, then given to the custody and control of only NFL-employed ballboys for handling during the game? It may well now come to pass that the league will insist on a uniform psi for all teams, that it will inflate the balls itself to exactly that specification, and there will be no discretion for individual teams’ tastes. Your QB doesn’t like the level of pressure, get over it or get a new QB. Part of me wonders why this has not happened already. Pitchers don’t get to take a bag of hand-selected balls out to the mound with them, the Spurs don’t grab a rebound and then ask for a different basketball while they are on offense, etc. Seems like a fair resolution to me. I have not heard one current or former player or coach ever cop to changing the inflation of footballs before or during a game. Most QBs will admit that the lower inflated balls would be easier to throw in certain or maybe all conditions–this from Tarkenton is typical: Q: What are your thoughts on `Deflate-gate,’ Fran? A: “This has been going on for a lot of years. We always rubbed the balls down and got them ready when I played. But we didn’t, in my era, deflate the balls. When you deflate the balls, it’s easier to throw it and easier to catch it. And you don’t fumble as much. “It is wrong. And the NFL has said nothing. Nothing.” Despite the fact that most QBs consider it advantageous to have the balls under-inflated and most also conceded to have “worked up” the footballs, you would think it would have occurred to them to outright deflate them. Yet it seems none did. Why not, one could wonder, especially if the league did not consider that a serious rules violation. Perhaps the players thought it would be cheating (see Tarkenton) and/or that the league could consider it so. You think?
__________________
Now watch what you say, or they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh, fanatical, criminal Won't you sign up your name? We'd like to feel you're acceptable, respectable, presentable, a vegetable If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other.- Ulysses S. Grant, 18th US President. Last edited by nolemmings; 01-31-2015 at 11:43 AM.
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Hybrid Mode
