Can't fight City Hall- eBay protecting their large sellers (probstein content)

[Qcards]

I read these threads where Rick is accused of shilling and I don’t really get it.

I am a regular consignor to Rick. I send him my stuff, he scans it, lists it and sends me the funds, minus his fee, after the auction is over.

My items generally go for market value and I am happy with his services.

If you look at the amount of items he is listing and closing every day, he does not have time to monitor if people are bidding on their own items.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Qcards

I read these threads where Rick is accused of shilling and I don’t really get it.

I am a regular consignor to Rick. I send him my stuff, he scans it, lists it and sends me the funds, minus his fee, after the auction is over.

My items generally go for market value and I am happy with his services.

If you look at the amount of items he is listing and closing every day, he does not have time to monitor if people are bidding on their own items.

How about I offer Rick Probstein the opportunity to take a polygraph test and answer a few questions about fraud? If he passes he gets $100,000. If the results show that he has engaged in fraud he pays me $20,000. Since he hasn't done anything wrong this should be an easy pay day, right? Maybe you can get in on the bet?

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Qcards

he does not have time to monitor if people are bidding on their own items.

I said I was done with this thread, but I need to address this statement because it keeps getting repeated over and over by multiple individuals.

Nobody is asking Rick to monitor his auctions. We're asking that he do something about those who are caught red handed shilling their own auctions (like blocking consignors). Is that really asking too much or am I being unreasonable?

[Peter_Spaeth]

God forbid a business owner monitor his own business to make sure it is operating honestly. Yeah that is expecting WAY too much.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

I said I was done with this thread, but I need to address this statement because it keeps getting repeated over and over by multiple individuals.

Nobody is asking Rick to monitor his auctions. We're asking that he do something about those who are caught red handed shilling their own auctions (like blocking consignors). Is that really asking too much or am I being unreasonable?

No it's not unreasonable. We in the auction house business do monitor our auctions. No, we aren't perfect but we will respond to any situation that doesn't look to be on the up and up. And I know for a fact several other auction houses do it too as I have gotten calls from them concerning these kinds of issues.

And I am with you David, because someone submits a card to a company and doesn't shill it doesn't mean it doesn't happen (and happen often) with their other consignors. I personally don't have proof of the Probstein issues other than what has been pointed out on this board. And they are worrisome.

In Probstein's defense, I asked him about this one time and he sent me a list of at least a hundred (I think it was a few hundred) bidders he had blocked on ebay, due to these type issues. Is he doing enough, I don't know?

[brob28]

Originally Posted by Leon

No it's not unreasonable. We in the auction house business do monitor our auctions. No, we aren't perfect but we will respond to any situation that doesn't look to be on the up and up. And I know for a fact several other auction houses do it too as I have gotten calls from them concerning these kinds of issues.

And I am with you David, because someone submits a card to a company and doesn't shill it doesn't mean it doesn't happen (and happen often) with their other consignors. I personally don't have proof of the Probstein issues other than what has been pointed out on this board. And they are worrisome.

In Probstein's defense, I asked him about this one time and he sent me a list of at least a hundred (I think it was a few hundred) bidders he had blocked on ebay, due to these type issues. Is he doing enough, I don't know?

Not attacking you on this Leon, but a thought for Probstein. Blocking the bidder is a joke - how hard is it for the "shiller" to create a new account? If he really wants to clean it up he needs to start blocking consignors who have the shilled auctions. Before anyone gets to crazy with me on this - I'm not saying he should immediately ban consignors of all suspect auctions, but he can certainly ban those who have multiple auctions that display this suspect bidding activity.

[bbeck]

[QUOTE=Leon;1367663]No it's not unreasonable. We in the auction house business do monitor our auctions. No, we aren't perfect but we will respond to any situation that doesn't look to be on the up and up. And I know for a fact several other auction houses do it too as I have gotten calls from them concerning these kinds of issues.

And I am with you David, because someone submits a card to a company and doesn't shill it doesn't mean it doesn't happen (and happen often) with their other consignors. I personally don't have proof of the Probstein issues other than what has been pointed out on this board. And they are worrisome.

In Probstein's defense, I asked him about this one time and he sent me a list of at least a hundred (I think it was a few hundred) bidders he had blocked on ebay, due to these type issues. Is he doing enough, I don't know?[/QUOTE

I find it hard to believe his block bidder list is solely predicated on possible shill bidders, more likely on bidders who have called him out on specific issues they have had with him or accused him of wrong doings. He doesn't want those low feedback dings to kill his ebay discounts.

[savedfrommyspokes]

Originally Posted by bbeck

He doesn't want those low feedback dings to kill his ebay discounts.

As with several of the other large sellers on ebay (PWCC 4SC/NESC, battersbox) who are a part of the Emerging Verticals program, each of their additional ebay discounts (the form of discount varies from seller to seller)are pre negotiated and locked in. These sellers have an Emerging Verticals Account Manager,who is over the sports card category, to personally assist with concerns that arise. The goal of this program is to drive sales for ebay (category by category) by increasing the sales of the largest sellers within each category. A top down approach to driving sales.

This is the explanation that I received from an ebay EV AM of a different ebay category.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by savedfrommyspokes

As with several of the other large sellers on ebay (PWCC 4SC/NESC, battersbox) who are a part of the Emerging Verticals program, each of their additional ebay discounts (the form of discount varies from seller to seller)are pre negotiated and locked in. These sellers have an Emerging Verticals Account Manager,who is over the sports card category, to personally assist with concerns that arise. The goal of this program is to drive sales for ebay (category by category) by increasing the sales of the largest sellers within each category. A top down approach to driving sales.

This is the explanation that I received from an ebay EV AM of a different ebay category.

Take-home message is that if you are not part of the 'Emerging Verticals' program, you are part of the 'Bent Over Vertically' program.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by runscott

take-home message is that if you are not part of the 'emerging verticals' program, you are part of the 'bent over vertically' program.

lol!

[xplainer]

Originally Posted by Runscott

Take-home message is that if you are not part of the 'Emerging Verticals' program, you are part of the 'Bent Over Vertically' program.

Excellent post . Accurate and funny.

I stay away from Probstein and the others mention. I know they are shilled.

The whole process lends itself to it.

The ball card world has a lot of unscrupulous people in it.

[tschock]

Originally Posted by Qcards

I read these threads where Rick is accused of shilling and I don’t really get it.

I am a regular consignor to Rick. I send him my stuff, he scans it, lists it and sends me the funds, minus his fee, after the auction is over.

My items generally go for market value and I am happy with his services.

If you look at the amount of items he is listing and closing every day, he does not have time to monitor if people are bidding on their own items.

Call me confused, but what I "don't really get" is these kinds of justifications. What you are saying is that Rick sells my stuff fine, I get my money, so what's everyone's problem? I don't think there is ANY question about Rick getting the money for his consignees. He is obvious doing something right for his CONSIGNEES. But what about the buyers being screwed?

Sorry but to me, these kinds of posts reek of the "I'm getting mine so I don't have a problem with it" kind of response.

[calvindog]

1970 Topps Rico Petrocelli, PSA 9

7/30/14 eBay $35.00
3/2/14 probstein123 $202.50
1/10/13 eBay $42.00
12/16/11 eBay $29.99
6/2/11 eBay $30.00
3/16/11 eBay $22.00
2/13/11 eBay $28.51
7/14/10 eBay $30.00
11/20/09 eBay $29.99
4/3/09 eBay $52.50
5/27/08 eBay $30.00
4/29/08 eBay $45.00
1/9/07 eBay $36.11

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by calvindog

1970 Topps Rico Petrocelli, PSA 9

7/30/14 eBay $35.00
3/2/14 probstein123 $202.50
1/10/13 eBay $42.00
12/16/11 eBay $29.99
6/2/11 eBay $30.00
3/16/11 eBay $22.00
2/13/11 eBay $28.51
7/14/10 eBay $30.00
11/20/09 eBay $29.99
4/3/09 eBay $52.50
5/27/08 eBay $30.00
4/29/08 eBay $45.00
1/9/07 eBay $36.11

no way that card is shilled to 200.....if at 80 dollars you really going to risk 'winning' the card at 3x market price when its your own card..pleeeezzz..

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

no way that card is shilled to 200.....if at 80 dollars you really going to risk 'winning' the card at 3x market price when its your own card..pleeeezzz..

Pleeeezzz, Really your post are great. They always bring a smile to my face.

Why do you think shillers pay when they win their own auction listing instead of just canceling the transaction to avoid the fees.

[brob28]

Originally Posted by calvindog

1970 Topps Rico Petrocelli, PSA 9

7/30/14 eBay $35.00
3/2/14 probstein123 $202.50
1/10/13 eBay $42.00
12/16/11 eBay $29.99
6/2/11 eBay $30.00
3/16/11 eBay $22.00
2/13/11 eBay $28.51
7/14/10 eBay $30.00
11/20/09 eBay $29.99
4/3/09 eBay $52.50
5/27/08 eBay $30.00
4/29/08 eBay $45.00
1/9/07 eBay $36.11

Come on Jeff, nothing to conclude here - just two balls to the walls registry guys bidding aggressively in an open, transparent auction...

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by brob28

Come on Jeff, nothing to conclude here - just two balls to the walls registry guys bidding aggressively in an open, transparent auction...

Exactly! Funny how these bidding wars only seem to come up in Probstein and PWCC auctions.

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Exactly! Funny how these bidding wars only seem to come up in Probstein and PWCC auctions.

+1....I have had some of the same cards both these guys have had. I have NEVER had the kind of bidding wars they have. I have also seen my higher grade/nicer example card sell for less than their same/lower grade card. More examples than I care to mention. Some of it can be people that only want to deal exclusively with them - I get that. However, we are ALL selling on the exact same platform - Ebay. For buyers to bid up their items, and totally ignore other examples that are selling for less....I'm not buying it.

[MikeGarcia]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

+1....I have had some of the same cards both these guys have had. I have NEVER had the kind of bidding wars they have. I have also seen my higher grade/nicer example card sell for less than their same/lower grade card. More examples than I care to mention. Some of it can be people that only want to deal exclusively with them - I get that. However, we are ALL selling on the exact same platform - Ebay. For buyers to bid up their items, and totally ignore other examples that are selling for less....I'm not buying it.

... I follow the 1957 Topps set in PSA 7 and 8 to keep a finger on the pulse of the economy....the ''sold'' section in the search results is a head-scratcher sometimes , until you view the 'seller'.

..this is a great thread ; thanks to all the posters ; but this is the first time I've ever suffered a popcorn headache..

..

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

+1....I have had some of the same cards both these guys have had. I have NEVER had the kind of bidding wars they have. I have also seen my higher grade/nicer example card sell for less than their same/lower grade card. More examples than I care to mention. Some of it can be people that only want to deal exclusively with them - I get that. However, we are ALL selling on the exact same platform - Ebay. For buyers to bid up their items, and totally ignore other examples that are selling for less....I'm not buying it.

I've collected some 1950s sets in high grade, card by card -- and never once did I care who the seller was unless he had zero or very weird feedback. No one wants to deal exclusively with PWCC and Probstein unless you're a shill bidder.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Exactly! Funny how these bidding wars only seem to come up in Probstein and PWCC auctions.

Absolutely agree with this. I have put up cards on eBay a grade level over the ones sold in those two auctions a week later at the same or lesser price and they sit and rot. I know if I am an underbidder and the next week the same card in better shape pops up for a lesser or equal price I am on it. Add to that the 'loyalists' these guys seem to have and the stinky factor goes off the charts.