14+Rose HOFer ball

[Pickles]

A colleague was offered this ball, as is, not certified, for $1000, or $1500 with a PSA cert (card shop assumes risk)
I am only comfortable with Dimaggio, Ford, and somewhat comfortable, not there with Mantle, as those are the ones I know
Others are beyond my knowledge base
Sig I recognize (can not vouch for authenticity
Aaron
Greenberg
Ted Williams
JDMaggio
Mickey M
Mize
Kaline
Ferrell
Snyder
Rose
Gates Brown
Whitey Ford
Gehringer
Kell
Spahn
Yaz
Spahn


S I have 3 questions:
1- Thoughts on auto (real or not) for all
2- Any ideas on the signatures above Rose and 2 above Ferrell? I suspect the original collector was a Detroit Tigers fan (Gates Brown sig among HOFers) so that may be a starting point. Truly have no other clues
3- If this goes to PSA an say, all but 1,2,3 autos are genuine. Will the ball get a cert with disclaimer (liike the clubhouse) or will it get rejected? Card shop guy says if any sig is not real, ball will not get COA, hence the $500/$150 gamble he is taking..
Thanks in advance
B

[CollectiblesNJ]

I like the Kaline, Whitey Ford, Rose Joe D, Williams, Gehringer


The Mantle feels right but looks like a odd example curious to hear thoughts on this,

If offered to me I would make an offer to purchase this ball for authentication

[Lordstan]

1) I think they mostly look real, but I don't care as much for the Aaron.
2) Above Rose looks like Bill Freehan. Directly above Ferrell is Jim Northrup, but can't say for sure on the other.
3)While not 100% sure, I do think PSA will give a cert for the autos that they feel are real and document those they think aren't in the letter they provide.

Two above Ferrell - possibly John Hiller?

[bbcard1]

I hate that ball at the numbers you're talking about. Lots of badly faded autos with every possibility they will continue to fade. Of course, I am not a real auto collector, but I wouldn't touch regardless of authenticity and don't find it desirable at any price. But then again, I just spent around the same amount on a mid-grade set of 1950s baseball cards that he might easily feel the same way about. Eye of beholder.

Mantles are tough. I have known of good ones gotten in person that have come back as bad from JSA even though I know they were signed in person. Just so commonly forged it is natural for authenticators to err on the conservative side.

[earlywynnfan]

I agree with Todd! It's not my money, so really it's none of my business, but I don't think this is a $1500 ball by any means. No way it brings that from a major auction house. It has a bold Greenberg, but none of the other keys are exceptional.

Just my (usually worthless) opinion.

Ken

[Klrdds]

I am sorry but I do not see any appeal in this ball at any price. You have HOFers mixed with some lower tier players, and the signatures are fading and bleeding and will continue to do so with time. None of these players are rare or high priced signatures.
Whatever autographs you are wanting on this ball whether single signed or multi signed you can certainly wait and find better quality at a more competitive price than what this is being offered for with or without the cert.

[vthobby]

It is a $250 ball maybe on a GOOD day. UGH! To the person that got the ball, I'm sure there is more intrinsic value there but whoever would spend that kind of money on this baseball is crazy. The sigs are fine. The ball is not.

peace, mike

PS The ball is one of those crappy little league type baseballs so this was most likely a multi year experience at Cooperstown and at shows or games maybe. So once again, intrinsic value "yes", real value, a couple of hundred on a real sunny day in the spring when folks are yearning for baseball!

[RichardSimon]

Vtg is correct, that ball could be put on ebay and sit there till doomsday at $1000 or any price close to that. At best it is worth $250.

[CollectiblesNJ]

I would be a buyer on this ball at $250, I would bet if you get PSA that ball goes north of $600 on ebay. Def not worth a G though even to keep for yourself.

[valediction]

Originally Posted by RichardSimon

Vtg is correct, that ball could be put on ebay and sit there till doomsday at $1000 or any price close to that. At best it is worth $250.

I agree. It's a mishmash ball. As Mike pointed out, the value is largely in the memories of the one who got the signatures. Anyone going to shows from the 1980's to today could have put that together. The fading makes it a tough sell, and none of the signatures are that tough. Add to that the fact that there is no theme to it. It's not a HOF ball, it's not a Detroit greats ball, though it has many elements of both. For the HOF collector it's missing a decent amount of easy guys that are no longer with us (Musial, Killebrew, Feller, Kiner, etc) For the Detroit collectors, how much would they pay for a ball with so many NON Detroit players, even if they are great?

[joed25]

All the signatures are authentic. The Hank Greenberg I'm pretty sure is good as well. That's the only one I'm not certain about but pretty sure it's good. I would pay $300. Please contact me if its for sale. Thanks.

[tazdmb]

It is Northrop and Hiller above Ferrell, that being said, wouldn't touch the ball.

[Pickles]

Thanks all forthe feedback. This is what I have so far, which I will forward to my co worker:

1- It appears the sigs 9with possible exception of Aaron) are legitimate
2- Missing players are Detroit Tigers (1968?) Bill Freehan, Northrup, J Hiller
3- Ball not worth $1000 raw (or certified for that matter) Estimates of $250 (I seriously doubt it could be that low, too many deceased HOFs to average $10/$15 an auto) nut serious concern for continuous fading of signatures

Is there anything that could be done to lengthen or eliminate the fading? Clearly using gloves when handling the ball comes to mind, but would a UV cover or some coating help the situation? Purely hypothetical b/c I do not think the card shop guy will drop to the $500-$600 price point which would be a more reasonable estimate if all sigs are real ($30-40 per HOF, $10 for others...) . I'd think seriously about it at $500, but I am just advising a colleague

Thanks again

[gashouse34]

Originally Posted by Klrdds

I am sorry but I do not see any appeal in this ball at any price. You have HOFers mixed with some lower tier players, and the signatures are fading and bleeding and will continue to do so with time. None of these players are rare or high priced signatures.
Whatever autographs you are wanting on this ball whether single signed or multi signed you can certainly wait and find better quality at a more competitive price than what this is being offered for with or without the cert.

Totally agree...I'm surprised some of the other signatures haven't faded/bled more than they have already. I completely avoid ever buying signed balls that are of cheap quality...no matter who has signed them. No doubt the signatures on this ball are going to get worse. I'd save my money until something better came along. Never heard of shellacking/coating a cheap ball before so don't know if that is even possible without major issues? Aside from that keeping it away from direct light, extreme temperatures and oxygen exposure is all you can do to prolong its demise (at least that i'm aware of).

[vthobby]

Kevin,

Being on Ebay for almost 20 years and handling over 5000 transactions, I respectfully disagree with you. As Richard Simon (his credentials are just like mine X 15!) also agreed with me, this ball does not matter if it is has JSA, PSA/DNA, or a bright red X-Mas bow on it. It is a neat item if you want to spend a couple of hundred and have some cool names but it is NOT an investment piece or something that will go up significantly with a COA. This ball is just what the companies want you to send in as they snicker while charging you $XXX to authenticate an item where the authentication fee is double or even to the items value.

It makes no sense.

Just my 2 cents.

By the way, I agree with you, if you had $250 disposable and wanted some cool names on a ball then go for it........but don't fool yourself into thinking it will shoot up in value with a COA.

peace, mike

PS To answer Pickles question.....the fading/bleeding is because of the type of baseball that was used. The only way to try and stop that is to keep it away from sunlight but because of the ball used, I'm afraid at some point those faded/bleeding autos will be tough to decipher.

[Mr. Zipper]

I agree with those who put this in the $250 - $300 range. It has serious condition issues and an off brand ball featuring relatively common signatures with no cohesive theme. Certification will not add value after fees.

In my experience, the kind of collectors who have larger budgets are typically not interested in pulling a "dented can" from the shelf. This is strictly a bargain hunter impulse item.

[Klrdds]

[QUOTE=vtgmsc;1359830]Kevin,

Being on Ebay for almost 20 years and handling over 5000 transactions, I respectfully disagree with you. As Richard Simon (his credentials are just like mine X 15!) also agreed with me, this ball does not matter if it is has JSA, PSA/DNA, or a bright red X-Mas bow on it. It is a neat item if you want to spend a couple of hundred and have some cool names but it is NOT an investment piece or something that will go up significantly with a COA. This ball is just what the companies want you to send in as they snicker while charging you $XXX to authenticate an item where the authentication fee is double or even to the items value.

It makes no sense.

Just my 2 cents.

By the way, I agree with you, if you had $250 disposable and wanted some cool names on a ball then go for it........but don't fool yourself into thinking it will shoot up in value with a COA.

peace, mike

PS To answer Pickles question.....the fading/bleeding is because of the type of baseball that was used. The only way to try and stop that is to keep it away from sunlight but because of the ball used, I'm afraid at some point those faded/bleeding autos will be tough to decipher.[/QUOTE

I agree with you about the buying and TPA price gouging on an item like this.
When I buy I always look at value paid versus what it is worth , and what is the investment potential. Not being a dealer only a collector I view it one side only, not from both sides as a dealer would. Plus I agree with you about Richard Simon.

[Bestdj777]

For what it is worth, here is a link to my HOF ball:

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...=mantle&page=2

It cost less than three hundred, has a lot of the bigger names, was signed in the same color pen, and does not have a lot of fading issues. It is up to your friend to make his own decision, but I hope he passes on this one.

[RichardSimon]

The worst thing about the ball is the commonality of signatures issue. As stated in earlier posts, it is not a HOF ball, it is not a Tigers ball, it is not a 1986 Mets ball , it does not fit with almost any collection.

[Econteachert205]

No superstar ball is complete without gates brown.

[djson1]

I don't know if anybody mentioned this, but the ball also doesn't seem to be on any official ML ball. I can't tell from the pics, but for some reason the hide looks like a non-official ball. This is probably causing the bleeding on some signatures. That's another reason why the price is too steep, as collectors will pay less if the ball is not on an OAL/ONL/OML ball (if it indeed isn't an official ball).

For me also, I would pay less because the superstar sigs are mixed with lesser known non-stars.