Perhaps the most unethical thing I've seen in our hobby. Topps should be ashamed

[jhs5120]

Okay, so I'm a little slow and this is very complicated.

If I understand this, Topps created 2013 Kris Bryant cards and added them to 2014 cases. The 2013 cards are now (of course) considered his rookie which bring down the value of the 2014 cards.

I mean, I wouldn't consider it unethical just lack of foresight. I'm sure Topps thought it would be cool to add a top prospect to a set that he was previously excluded from. I doubt they considered the impact the release would have on the 2014 cards.

[steve B]

Except that there are a bunch of actual 2013 cards - Rize, Leaf, a bunch of other Panini sets, diamond prospects, Bowman Draft..........

I looked at a couple of the Bowmans on Ebay, and I'm puzzled how Topps put a 2013 copyright notice on a 2014 card. Makes me wonder if they actually registered a copyright for it.

I get how it's not at all good for Topps to start up the "time machine", but I also think it's pretty silly for anyone to consider a card issued in a 2014 product to be a 2013 card just because the manufacturer put that date on it and used last years design. Even sillier for them to pay a huge premium for it.

Even sillier for anyone to consider either as his "rookie" card when he still hasn't played a game in the majors. If it is, then the actual 2013 issues that had a mix of current players and prospects should have more claim to it. Like maybe Bowman Sterling.



Steve B

[irishdenny]

Some where iN All of this...
iS a Class Action Law Suite Just Waiting to HaPPeN ~

[the 'stache]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

Okay, so I'm a little slow and this is very complicated.

If I understand this, Topps created 2013 Kris Bryant cards and added them to 2014 cases. The 2013 cards are now (of course) considered his rookie which bring down the value of the 2014 cards.

I mean, I wouldn't consider it unethical just lack of foresight. I'm sure Topps thought it would be cool to add a top prospect to a set that he was previously excluded from. I doubt they considered the impact the release would have on the 2014 cards.

Jason, let me try to explain this better. This was not a lack of foresight. Topps plans out what players will be released well in advance of the product coming out.

2013 Bowman Chrome had its complete run. The last leg of the Bowman Baseball/Bowman Chrome/Bowman Draft Picks & Prospects hit the stores in the first week of December 2013. All the players in the 3 releases had been announced. The complete checklist was known. Everybody knew exactly what autos were released in each set.

Jump forward to the spring of 2014. Topps announces that Bowman Baseball 2014, which would be released on April 30th, 2014, would not only include Jose Abreu's first Bowman baseball card (and a Bowman Chrome card, and a Bowman Chrome prospect auto), but Kris Bryant would also see the debut
his debut in Bowman Baseball. And he, too, would have a Chrome and a Chrome prospect auto. So, Bowman Baseball, which is always a hot product, but can be even hotter depending on who signs, became the product to buy in 2014. Bryant is a mega prospect on the Bryce Harper/Mike Trout scale. Abreu is the best player to ever come out of Cuba. People pre-ordered boxes and cases, and when April 30th hit, the product was bought at record levels. For whatever reason, the rumor began that Bryant's Chrome prospect auto would be short printed. Because of that factor, the price for the cards that were found reached astronomical prices. Base Chrome autos (unserialized cards) were going for over $1,000 each. The product went like nuts. Well, Bowman Chrome made its debut in September, and it, too, would include the Bryant 2014 Bowman Chrome auto card, the same one that came out in 2014 Bowman. So, people were learning that the card was not short printed. A lot of people ended up overpaying because of a perceived scarcity. I don't know if Topps started the rumor, but they certainly wouldn't lose out if they leaked it was short printed. It would drive more demand for their product. So anyway, Bowman Chromes sold. Boxes and cases. Topps made a small fortune. More Kris Bryant Chrome prospect auto cards were had. But then a funny thing happened. One of Topps' other Bowman product lines, Bowman Platinum, came out. And somebody who opened a box pulled out a Kris Bryant Bowman Chrome prospect auto. But this was not a 2014 card. This was not the card that came out in April, and then in September. This was a card that had the same design as 2013 Bowman Chrome. 2013 Bowman Chrome last came out in September of 2013. This was November of 2014. So, all the people who had bought case after case, box after box of 2014 Bowman Baseball, and 2014 Bowman Chrome baseball, in order to get Kris Bryant's first Bowman Chrome prospect auto...with the appearance of 2013 Bowman Chrome Kris Bryant autos, all those people no longer had his first prospect auto. They now had a Kris Bryant Bowman Chrome auto, which still carried value. But it had now been kicked down the road. Now, his 2013 Bowman Chrome prospect auto was his very best card. And if Bryant became a Hall of Famer 23 years from now, the card that will command the most money will not be the 2014 Bowman Chrome prospect auto card that is marked as his 1st Bowman Chrome card, the card that everybody thought was his first prospect auto card. The 2013 Bowman Chrome prospect auto card will be the most valuable.

Topps knowingly had Bryant sign 2013 Bowman Chrome cards AND 2014 Bowman Chrome cards. They released 2014 Bowman/Bowman Chrome with his auto cards just as they said they would. Then, after those had sold like crazy, and made Topps a fortune, they started putting his 2013 Chrome autos in other 2014 Bowman products to drive their sales, and in doing so, they said "sorry, all you guys that spent tens of thousands of dollars to get those rare 2014 cards. They're still valuable, as they have his auto, but they're not "the card". And all those people that bought his 2014 cards, and the boxes and cases of boxes to acquire one of those rare autographed prospect cards, they were sold product under false pretenses. And this wasn't something unforeseen. Topps knew exactly what they were doing.

[sbfinley]

Originally Posted by the 'stache

And if Bryant became a Hall of Famer 23 years from now, the card that will command the most money will not be the 2014 Bowman Chrome prospect auto card that is marked as his 1st Bowman Chrome card, the card that everybody thought was his first prospect auto card. The 2013 Bowman Chrome prospect auto card will be the most valuable.

That's a huge if and unequally the biggest reason some collectors are mad. Chrome is king and undoubtedly the two biggest cards of the past 20 years are the Pujols and Trout Chrome Autos. One is at almost $3k and the other is at $1000-$1200 and climbing. The huge caveat, though, is that those are both two players who were (or currently are) considered the best in the game. Yeah, if Kris Bryant has an amazing career and goes down as one of the all-time greats the fact he has two Bowman Chrome AU Rc's that aren't SP'd could dilute the prices somewhat, but odds are even if he only had a Sp'd 2014 Bowman Chrome Auto in 5-10 year it would still be only worth a percentage of the current market value. Right now Bowman Chrome Autos of Austin Meadows, Miguel Sano, Byron Buxton, Carlos Correa, Javier Beaz, and Albert Almora go anywhere from $50-$150 for base Chrome autos. (60% of the people who read this will say "who?") For reference you can also get these bowman Chrome Autos in the same price range and sometimes cheaper: David Price, Stephen Strasburg, Madison Bumgarner, Buster Posey, Felix Hernandez, Jason Heyward, Freddie Freeman, Sonny Gray (around $20), Jose Abreu, Mike Stanton, Josh Donaldson, and a host of other All-Stars. Three years ago the Bryce Harper Bowman Chrome Base AU was a $500-$700 card, now it's $175. Heck, Toe Nash was $300 at one point. To me this argument is just invalid.

Originally Posted by I Only Smoke 4 the Cards

Was it on the 2013 checklist?

No.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Buying expensive boxes of cards with an extremely low chance of getting a particular chase card is just dumb anyhow.

Whole lot of idiots at Net54 then.
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=194058