Ripped off by a James Spence lifetime guarantee

[khw]

Originally Posted by Runscott

There is a much longer thread about this over in another forum where Eric is a much more extensive poster. It might shed additional light on the matter.

Apparently Spence only reached out to Eric once Eric had gone public with this.

OK then that would be a different story if he tried to resolve it and he just avoided him , but a previous post brought up something i thought of as well. unless the letter had a image or marked ball there is nothing to tie the ball to the letter , almost like a auction letter . this was pre sticker , photo letter etc . like i said before in this business you take one of the chin ever so often , and if you want to buy and sell you better have some knowledge of what you are doing and not go on anybodys letter or card , i would not have bought that ball even if it had a present day jsa full letter

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by khw

OK then that would be a different story if he tried to resolve it and he just avoided him , but a previous post brought up something i thought of as well. unless the letter had a image or marked ball there is nothing to tie the ball to the letter , almost like a auction letter . this was pre sticker , photo letter etc . like i said before in this business you take one of the chin ever so often , and if you want to buy and sell you better have some knowledge of what you are doing and not go on anybodys letter or card , i would not have bought that ball even if it had a present day jsa full letter

That's how I feel about it as well. A JSA letter means nothing to me, even if it has a photo of the item, but without a photo the letter should be worthless even to those who put confidence in letters.

But the problem with COA's for any product is that you should be able to trust them - their entire purpose is to give a customer confidence where he would otherwise have none. Even worse for JSA and PSA items, as those two companies are considered the best, and do huge amounts of business with high-dollar items, which allows them to point to such items and give their buyers even more false confidence.

Collectors like us should know better, but folks on the edge of autograph collecting might have to take a few lumps as you pointed out. Not fair, but that's how it is.

[EricS]

As I mentioned in the longer article, JSA had originally told me they wouldn't talk to me about it because James Spence the person wrote the guarantee, not JSA.

The good news is, I just spoke to James Spence on the phone and he agreed to return my money. I want to thank him for doing the right thing here.
Eric

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by EricS

As I mentioned in the longer article, JSA had originally told me they wouldn't talk to me about it because James Spence the person wrote the guarantee, not JSA.

The good news is, I just spoke to James Spence on the phone and he agreed to return my money. I want to thank him for doing the right thing here.
Eric

Eric, thanks for embarrassing him into doing the right thing. It's a good precedent for future victims.

[Duluth Eskimo]

So the bottom line is that the person did the right thing and honored his lifetime guarantee even after being thrown under the bus in a public forum. I would suggest in the future to possibly ask the person privately before being going public, but that wouldn't allow you to post on your web site.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

So the bottom line is that the person did the right thing and honored his lifetime guarantee even after being thrown under the bus in a public forum. I would suggest in the future to possibly ask the person privately before being going public, but that wouldn't allow you to post on your web site.

It's in the original link - you must have missed it.

[Exhibitman]

Strange that it took a public flogging to get a just outcome? I think not. Sometimes you need to shine a light into the corners to get the roaches to scurry.

"Publicity is justly commended as a remedy for social and industrial diseases. Sunlight is said to be the best of disinfectants; electric light the most efficient policeman."--Louis Brandeis

[Duluth Eskimo]

Originally Posted by Runscott

It's in the original link - you must have missed it.

Well, I did read the original link and I would encourage you to read it closer. It says he contacted JSA not James Spence. Yes he is part owner, but he could have just spoken with an employee. Obviously when Spence sold the ball, he was his own entity. Speak with the person Spence and don't expect some employee that has nothing to do with a former business to discuss something they had nothing to do with.

Don't get me wrong, I am not an apologist for the TPA system. I think they make mistakes, but common sense dictates that if you have a problem with a person, speak to that person first. The OP did not do business with JSA, he did business with Spence. I get tired of the stupidity that is TPA bashing. It's an opinion, if you don't like it don't use it. If you are relying solely on their letter, pull your head out of your ass and use some common sense.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

Well, I did read the original link and I would encourage you to read it closer. It says he contacted JSA not James Spence. Yes he is part owner, but he could have just spoken with an employee. Obviously when Spence sold the ball, he was his own entity. Speak with the person Spence and don't expect some employee that has nothing to do with a former business to discuss something they had nothing to do with.

Don't get me wrong, I am not an apologist for the TPA system. I think they make mistakes, but common sense dictates that if you have a problem with a person, speak to that person first. The OP did not do business with JSA, he did business with Spence. I get tired of the stupidity that is TPA bashing. It's an opinion, if you don't like it don't use it. If you are relying solely on their letter, pull your head out of your ass and use some common sense.

Common sense would also say that if an employee of a company named 'James Spence Authentication' said that a lifetime guarantee on a ball authenticated by 'James Spence' was not going to be honored, then that employee was given that line as part of the company's policy;i.e-by James Spence. If not, that employee should be fired.

But I agree that the OP should have found a way to speak with James Spence prior to posting a thread about this - at least until he reached the conclusion that James Spence was avoiding him.

I think we are in agreement that "If you are relying solely on their letter, pull your head out of your ass and use some common sense."

[khw]

it would be assumtion that when the submitter sent to jsa he included the spence letter from 1993 , and if he did then hats off to whoever failed it even with the letter , just too many facts left off , but that is a important one , still i dont care what anybody says james spence show off collectibles is not tied to jsa. when spence joined psa/dna he sold them his retail inventory i believe and stopped doing sales business anyway

[EricS]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

So the bottom line is that the person did the right thing and honored his lifetime guarantee even after being thrown under the bus in a public forum. I would suggest in the future to possibly ask the person privately before being going public, but that wouldn't allow you to post on your web site.

I did try to ask Spence privately. Not sure where you are getting this from. Did you read the original article? I had reached out to Spence to give him the chance to make this right. JSA had said they won't speak to me. They also said that the letter was written by Spence and not JSA so they had nothing to do with it.

[Duluth Eskimo]

Originally Posted by EricS

I did try to ask Spence privately. Not sure where you are getting this from. Did you read the original article? I had reached out to Spence to give him the chance to make this right. JSA had said they won't speak to me. They also said that the letter was written by Spence and not JSA so they had nothing to do with it.

You said you called JSA, not James Spence. JSA is a company with more than James Spence as an owner. If you had called, asked to speak to James Spence Jr and / or specifically sent James Spence Jr (the person) emails without response I would be inclined to agree with you more. JSA the company owes you nothing. Deal with the person you have an issue with

[shelly]

This all bull. Bottom line when Spence was Spence he authenticated a ball that has his life time guarantee on it. He is alive and well and worth a lot more now than then. If he did not know what he was doing in 1993 he should pay for his mistake. By not doing so it just proves what his word means. NOTHING

[Duluth Eskimo]

Well, he did pay for it. Maybe you should read a little closer too. You guys just don't get it. You guys are always right and never make mistakes, yet are always first to point out everyone else's mistakes. It's an opinion. If you don't like their opinion, don't use it.