Some rare and expensive bakery goodies......

[the-illini]

Originally Posted by Bicem

The only thing I don't understand about this thread is why Brian won't even consider that just maybe, the guy was mistaken and didn't know what he had (as others have stated). Like it's not even remotely possible. This honest gentleman (selling fake cards ) could have easily acquired them, had never seen or heard about them before, and thus assumed and truly believed that they were not genuine.

There's zero possiblity of that because he said they were fakes?

Yeah, why was this honest gentleman selling fake cards at all?

[Brian Van Horn]

Originally Posted by the-illini

Yeah, why was this honest gentleman selling fake cards at all?

Chris,

That question I can not provide an answer to and never will be able to satisfy the curiosity.

[T206Collector]

Unless we know why the original seller believed them to be fake, his statement that they are fake is without any credibility. That is why no one is able to buy into Brian's story here.

My guess -- pure and simple -- is that the seller acquired them from someone who told him they were fake; or the seller had them appraised by someone he trusted who told him they were fake. Any of those people is just offering an opinion as to authenticity unless they printed them or fabricated them personally.

I have a signed T206 Cobb that James Spence told me was fake. Does that make it so? In the hobby today, you bet it does.

If Brian himself does not know who fabricated them, then the best anyone can hope for is an expert opinion. And the experts on Net54 have clearly weighed in on them being authentic.

This is all that matters.

[Brian Van Horn]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

Unless we know why the original seller believed them to be fake, his statement that they are fake is without any credibility. That is why no one is able to buy into Brian's story here.

My guess -- pure and simple -- is that the seller acquired them from someone who told him they were fake; or the seller had them appraised by someone he trusted who told him they were fake. Any of those people is just offering an opinion as to authenticity unless they printed them or fabricated them personally.

I have a signed T206 Cobb that James Spence told me was fake. Does that make it so? In the hobby today, you bet it does.

If Brian himself does not know who fabricated them, then the best anyone can hope for is an expert opinion. And the experts on Net54 have clearly weighed in on them being authentic.

This is all that matters.

The original seller has credibility in my eyes.

[Bocabirdman]

Originally Posted by Brian Van Horn

The original seller has credibility in my eyes.

I have no doubt that you believe this seller to be honest. Honesty does not eliminate the possibility of being wrong. Your trust is commendable but with out the missing piece, the "why he believes them to be fake", I am afraid that this discussion will go unresolved. He saw Big Foot but didn't shoot him and bring back a body. There is nothing to back up his statement (at least that you have conveyed as yet). I have no dog in this fight but, Brian, you are convinced. Everyone else lacks your conviction in his honesty and credibility.

I shall step back now and watch the merry-go-round go 'round.

[Brian Van Horn]

Originally Posted by Bocabirdman

I have no doubt that you believe this seller to be honest. Honesty does not eliminate the possibility of being wrong. Your trust is commendable but with out the missing piece, the "why he believes them to be fake", I am afraid that this discussion will go unresolved. He saw Big Foot but didn't shoot him and bring back a body. There is nothing to back up his statement (at least that you have conveyed as yet). I have no dog in this fight but, Brian, you are convinced. Everyone else lacks your conviction in his honesty and credibility.

I shall step back now and watch the merry-go-round go 'round.

Yeah, but this merry-go-round doesn't cause motion sickness .

[Brian Van Horn]

Thank you, Todd.

Here are parts 1 and 2. To clarify in part 2, I did see the guy setup at the Cleveland National (1999?). I was not part of the first discussion (now stop cheering ):

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...=Herpolsheimer

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...=Herpolsheimer

[the-illini]

Originally Posted by Brian Van Horn

The original seller has credibility in my eyes.

I certainly respect your opinion Brian and I know you are very well-versed in vintage cards, but without a "why" or at least a name for this person, this is the Herpolshimer equivalent of trying to prove the Loch Ness monster is real based on anecdotal evidence.

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by Brian Van Horn

The original seller has credibility in my eyes.

For any reasons other than the following?

1. He said they were fake
2. He priced them low
3. He wrote the prices on them

[Brian Van Horn]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

For any reasons other than the following?

1. He said they were fake
2. He priced them low
3. He wrote the prices on them

Yeah, just one small almost imperceptible reason. His honesty.

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by Brian Van Horn

Yeah, just one small almost imperceptible reason. His honesty.

Was he infallible?

[the-illini]

Originally Posted by Brian Van Horn

Yeah, just one small almost imperceptible reason. His honesty.

So you have other experiences that validate his honesty, or are you just a good judge of character? It would help your argument if you would provide something other than parroting the same line about this guy being honest.

[Bocabirdman]

Originally Posted by Brian Van Horn

Yeah, just one small almost imperceptible reason. His honesty.

I repeat myself. Honesty does not an expert make. An honest person can be wrong. ( I slink back to the shadows, upset with myself for posting a second time in the thread with no likely resolution)