Yet Another T206 Sheet Size Discussion

[atx840]

Here is one for you Steve.

When reviewing the SLs PSA pop report totals there is some interesting data showing up.

I broke the 48 SLs up into two groups, the 34 printed with OM/Pied/Hindu & the 14 printed with OM/Piedmont.

The 34 group has an average ratio of .76 Piedmonts per OM printed (51%-103%)
The 14 group has an average ratio of 1.6 Piedmonts per OM printed (140%-221%)

Those 14 show up on average more than double with Piedmonts than the other 34 group. Based on the pop numbers it appears that those 14 SLs were printed at one point (or always) separately than the 34.

[Runscott]

Chris, now that you are springing something new into the conversation, I am getting out the Orval Redenbacher in preparation for Ted's retort.

When my girlfriend goes shopping she buys SHIT. I buy the gourmet expensive stuff because when I eat it I want to taste it. But you know what's on my mind right now? It AIN'T the popcorn in my microwave, ...

[wolf441]

Originally Posted by Runscott

When my girlfriend goes shopping she buys SHIT. I buy the gourmet expensive stuff because when I eat it I want to taste it. But you know what's on my mind right now? It AIN'T the popcorn in my microwave, ...

This is what happens when the "theory of 12" is questioned:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czb4jn5y94g#t=142

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by wolf441

This is what happens when the "theory of 12" is questioned:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czb4jn5y94g#t=142

Yeah, I can see Ted and John Travolta in a sequel. Ted might want to get a brace for that gun, though.

[atx840]

You know what they put on popcorn in Canada instead of butter? Cheescurds & gravy. I've seen 'em do it, man. They drown 'em in that stuff.


Thanks Ted. The pop reports likely indicate that the 14 were printed separately in the Piedmont run than the 34 group, which to me could indicate that 34 was the number used on a sheet for that series.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by atx840

You know what they put on popcorn in Canada instead of butter? Cheescurds & gravy. I've seen 'em do it, man. They drown 'em in that stuff.

Wish I had some stats to contribute to the conversation.

All I can come up with is that Orval Redenbacher was two years old when the T206's were introduced. His father might have tossed him a T206 Wagner or Plank to teeth on, along with some popcorn of course.

[tedzan]

I wouldn't get too carried away with your "34 card sheet" myth.

Bob Revelle had a 26-12 season in 1908, and 29-11 season in 1909 pitching for the Richmond Colts.

Therefore, ALC most likely Double-Printed him.

Over 35 years of collecting T206's, I have seen more Revelle's with OLD MILL and HINDU than most of the other SL guys.

Furthermore, I know of at least one other candidate in the group of 34 that would also qualify as a Double-Print......perhaps Shaughnessy ?

Therefore my friend, we are talking about a 36-card sheet comprising of the 34 SL subjects and two Double-Prints (Revelle & Shaughnessy).



TED Z
.

[t206hound]

Originally Posted by tedzan

I wouldn't get too carried away with your "34 card sheet" myth.

Bob Revelle had a 26-12 season in 1908, and 29-11 season in 1909 pitching for the Richmond Colts.

Therefore, ALC most likely Double-Printed him.

Over 35 years of collecting T206's, I have seen more Revelle's with OLD MILL and HINDU than most of the other SL guys.

Furthermore, I know of at least one other candidate in the group of 34 that would also qualify as a Double-Print......perhaps Shaughnessy ?

Therefore my friend, we are talking about a 36-card sheet comprising of the 34 SL subjects and two Double-Prints (Revelle & Shaughnessy).



TED Z
.

Chris was asserting that the "14 Group" (non-Hindu) appeared in pop reports at a frequency roughly twice that of the "34 Group" (Hindu).

Ted suggests that two of the Hindu group were double printed.

If that were the case, then 16 cards (all 14 non-Hindu plus the two double-printed Hindu) would occur with twice the frequency of the remaining 32. Within the Hindu group, is there data to support that any of them appear at a 2-to-1 frequency to the others?

[tedzan]

Bob Revelle and Frank Shaughnessy show up with more HINDU backs than the other 32 - SL guys.
Both on Ebay listings and in POP reports.

The above observation....and, the experience of my 35 years collecting & selling T206's suggests
to me that these two SL subjects were Double-Printed.


TED Z

[steve B]

Originally Posted by t206hound

Chris was asserting that the "14 Group" (non-Hindu) appeared in pop reports at a frequency roughly twice that of the "34 Group" (Hindu).

Ted suggests that two of the Hindu group were double printed.

If that were the case, then 16 cards (all 14 non-Hindu plus the two double-printed Hindu) would occur with twice the frequency of the remaining 32. Within the Hindu group, is there data to support that any of them appear at a 2-to-1 frequency to the others?

Here's the Hindu numbers from SGC, It's hard to draw a solid conclusion from a small sample. And the numbers could of course be off because of resubs.

Another thing to consider is that in general the more popular cards - Known tough cards and HOF ers are typically around twice as likely to be graded.

bay 9
Bernhard 6
Breitenstine 10
carey 4 *
coles 10
cranston 8
ellam 10
foster 6
fritz 9
greminger 10


guiheen 8
helm 9
hickman 8
Hooker 5 *
Howard 7
Jordan 9
kiernan 8
lafitte 6
lipe 8
manion 12

mc cauley 6
molesworth 10
mullaney 8
otey 7
paige 5 *
perdue 8
persons 5 *
reagan 7
revelle 13
Ryan 8

Shaughnessy 15
smith 5 *
thornton 6
violat 3 *

There are a few I'd think might be shortprints, I marked any with less than 6 - Purely arbitrary, but there are six of them. Also six with 6-7. Of the remaining 22 only Shaughnessy, Manion and Revelle have more than 10. Shaughnessy is popular, so there may be some effect there. Double puts him at 7-8 a bit less puts it closer to 10.

So it's a group of 34, with two fairly consistent groups of 6 and probably two double prints Revelle and Manion. Shaughnessy I think is popular enough that the numbers are skewed

That's nice example of a group where I can't justify either the 12 or 17 theory. Both sort of fit, but neither is a really good fit. If it's 17 there's a bit of stretch to explain the imbalance. If it's 6 or 12, there's four leftover any way you figure it. But only 2 or three double prints. Which doesn't fit either.


Steve B

[freakhappy]

Originally Posted by atx840

You know what they put on popcorn in Canada instead of butter? Cheescurds & gravy. I've seen 'em do it, man. They drown 'em in that stuff.

Ugh...that's quite disgusting. Is that a product of Canada?

[mrvster]

my bb stephens showing a pink background to the right.....McIntyre?? downs?? from print group 2??

Erick, i'll send a better scan via email

[mrvster]

Chris b will elaborate on the yellow browns?? 460 F#30

[t206hound]

Originally Posted by mrvster

my bb stephens showing a pink background to the right.....McIntyre?? downs?? from print group 2??

Erick, i'll send a better scan via email

probably won't be able to figure it out. Too many possibilities.. could be McIntyre or Downs; possibly Oberlin or O'Neil.

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by atx840

Here is one for you Steve.

When reviewing the SLs PSA pop report totals there is some interesting data showing up.

I broke the 48 SLs up into two groups, the 34 printed with OM/Pied/Hindu & the 14 printed with OM/Piedmont.

The 34 group has an average ratio of .76 Piedmonts per OM printed (51%-103%)
The 14 group has an average ratio of 1.6 Piedmonts per OM printed (140%-221%)

Those 14 show up on average more than double with Piedmonts than the other 34 group. Based on the pop numbers it appears that those 14 SLs were printed at one point (or always) separately than the 34.

In 2006, when I was working on my all-PIEDMONT set, among the last few cards I needed to complete it were a good number of the group of 34 - SL guys.

So, there you are....some empirical data to support your observation on this subject of PIEDMONT vs OLD MILL SL's.



TED Z