N175 Goodwin and Company Gypsy Queen packs, cartons, cards etc....

[1880nonsports]

is the soldier with #7 - I have a couple I would trade 2 for 1...........

[jerrys]

I hoped that someone would have commented on my earlier post.

Nine years ago I wrote an article on early cigarette packs; it was published by SCD. The text in the article was slightly modified but the pictures that were set in position to show the reader the relationship between a pack and a card were reduced to a meaningless collage.

http://js-gallery.net/scd3-05.htm

This was the original submission:

http://js-gallery.net/packs.htm

As shown the N175 was attributed to the early GQ pack but after publication I received slight criticism for my assumption and advised that that pack was produced earlier than the cards. I am still without proof of a date.

[Leon]

Jerry
I don't think your links are working? I have never seen proof of dating of the cartons but the overprint on my pack points to 1887. I assume the white carton is from that year too. With no proof of a card inside a pack I have just thought the ornate one would go better with the N162s and the white looking one with N175s. I would like to eventually see some definitive proof and hopefully some day we will find it.

[Joe_G.]

Leon, the links seem to work for me.

Jerry, thanks for posting your research, I find it very interesting. We do know that the N175s were issued in 1887, likely later in the year while N162s are certainly an 1888 issue. Leon's overprint dates his pack very close to, if not within, the N175 run. The same pack could have continued into 1888 when the N162s were issued. I hope more details surface with time but lean towards thinking N175s were distributed in the pack with the overprint. Jerry, have you been able to study overprint(s) on the ornate GQ packs?

[1880nonsports]

not much has changed. I haven't thought much about it since relinquishing my pack. Time to re-visit the subject I suppose as my interest temporarily piqued.

few quick thoughts before I review Jerry's article.
Both cartons might have contained packs that contained inserts.
It makes sense that the one on the left is earlier despite it being more ornate as the "straight cut" verbiage and use of a label not sized for the box on the other suggests a contemporary or later issue. That said - I don't think the one on the right REPLACED the one on the left and expect the one on the left continued to be used. Perhaps the "SC" carton was to address a seperate (and smaller) segment of the market.

Both packs might have contained a card. and the one with a cancel appears within the correct time frame. Not sure about the photo cards but generally sets of the lithographed inserts were inserted all at the same time and all within a small window. I think the N162's would most likely have been in the box on the left. The GQ's - no idea.

[jerrys]

Leon, sorry about the link. I can not find anything wrong.

Joe, where can I find some GQ packs to study?

The GQs are conjecture.


Several ornate GQ cigarette boxes exist but the plainer GQ box is possibly unique.

[Joe_G.]

Hello Jerry, I thought that maybe you had some information, perhaps some overprints on the ornate packs, that led you to the believe that the N175s were matched to them while the later N162s were matched to the more plain packs. With Leon's overprint now entering the discussion, do you still believe N175s were issued with the ornate packs?