Joe Orlando is lying fakes flips look real..

[bbcemporium]

I find it a little odd this guy is having multiple conversations with people within the hobby discussing the fraud he is perpetrating. Maybe he just wants to brag about his work.

[vintagetoppsguy]

I've seen it mentioned several times now, but how does buying from a reputable dealer solve the problem? What’s to stop a reputable dealer from unknowingly buying one of these fakes for re-sell thinking it's legit?

Edited to add: Are reputable dealers immune to scams or something?

[MattyC]

I'd say for two reasons...

Reputable dealers and PSA Authorized dealers tend to have a better eye at spotting fakes than the average collector. One must be armed with considerable knowledge and experience to spot these fakes and veteran reputable dealers of PSA cards stand to have that knowledge and experience moreso than a random seller on Craigslist or eBay. Is it possible one can slip by the goalie, so to speak, sure, but then...

A reputable dealer stands to care more about his reputation and longterm business than a one-time score; a no-hassle return policy goes a long way when we are talking about these fake slabs.

I don't think anyone is asserting veteran reputable dealers are 100% inoculated against this scam, but in the interest of mitigation before and after a scam they are a prudent choice.

PS: like the sig line, very funny!

[vintagetoppsguy]

Hey, Matt. I can see your point, but I think most collectors (well, at least I do) get a card in the mail, look at it, possibly scan it, and then it goes into their safe or vault (or wherever) and they rarely look at it again. My point is, if it got past the dealer and the purchaser, it probably won't be realized that it's a fake for a long time to come (and it sounds like a lot of these are getting by). If you realized it immediately after purchase, sure they would have to take it back. And if it's an eBay purchase, they wouldn't have a choice - reputable dealer or not. But even any reputable dealer isn't going to guarantee a card past a certain time period, are they?

[MattyC]

David,

Good question-- there are a lot of high dollar card sellers who are definitely the stand-up type to honor a return at any point down the line, if it was discovered they missed a fake. Those are the guys I like to deal with. They highly value a loyal customer who pays promptly, who could be worth so much over the years of a relationship; if it became known they passed along a high-dollar fake even a year down the line, they would remember the sale and want to maintain that relationship. I've been told this directly by a few of my favorite sellers.

Personally, because I am rather risk averse on the subject, in addition to buying from known trusted sources, I will always take a high dollar card into PSA for a quick look-- I live close enough to drive the card down and it gives me peace of mind. This way I know for sure upon receipt of the card. I couldn't just put it away without that final check by the TPG itself. Might be overkill but it lets me sleep easy.

Best,

Matt

[Jdoggs]

Have there been any fakes detected in the new PSA holders?

[glynparson]

to justify Levi asking more than the average dealer. He is not going anywhere and he and Jimmy will know the card is fake and it would never get offered for sale. There are others that fall into this category as well.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Hey, Matt. I can see your point, but I think most collectors (well, at least I do) get a card in the mail, look at it, possibly scan it, and then it goes into their safe or vault (or wherever) and they rarely look at it again. My point is, if it got past the dealer and the purchaser, it probably won't be realized that it's a fake for a long time to come (and it sounds like a lot of these are getting by). If you realized it immediately after purchase, sure they would have to take it back. And if it's an eBay purchase, they wouldn't have a choice - reputable dealer or not. But even any reputable dealer isn't going to guarantee a card past a certain time period, are they?

well that's the buyers fault, the buyer should have it checked out if worried about a fake..

[Leon]

Originally Posted by bbcemporium

I find it a little odd this guy is having multiple conversations with people within the hobby discussing the fraud he is perpetrating. Maybe he just wants to brag about his work.

I agree. I don't know how many people he reached out to but I know Evan and I had a lot of conversations with him. He uses one of those phone jack devices that can't be traced. One time when he called me I tried to conference in the Secret Service covertly and it didn't work. I tried though....Yes, I believe he is somewhat of a braggart.

He uses pawns to sell his stuff and never lets anyone too close. Buying from a very known and trusted source is a good way (not foolproof) to avoid his fraud.

He preys on the greedy and inexperienced. As has been said, when you see a high end card being sold for less than half it's value, be very, very wary.