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#1
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Ben yours show the extra image that Al referenced. Could this be another reason yours are getting higher offers? Also Al mentions that his photo and Mark's both show wear on the arm. So are these later copies or a wire photo of the original image, and Ben's a "Type 1"?
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https://www.flickr.com/photos/bn2cardz/albums |
#2
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Some I can answer no these arenot copies of wire photos. Thats why I copied the back. You can see the back stamp from george burke and the refference # typed on top. so no these came from burke studios. Ben I also would like to see what the back of your photo looks like. Does it have different markings?
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The speed of light is faster that the speed of sound that is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak. Trying is the first step towards failing, and failing is the first step towards success! Life's lessons cost money Some lessons cost a lot.. |
#3
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EDIT: Well I see that an original negative shows it wasn't worn. Is it possible there was a copy of the negative made that has been worn down?
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https://www.flickr.com/photos/bn2cardz/albums Last edited by bn2cardz; 02-25-2014 at 09:52 AM. |
#4
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I would say mine and marks would be earlier versions just due to the fact that maybe that is the reason the photo was done again maybe they didnt like the "marks" that I pointed out and just redid the photo again. Only a guess. Kinda like a baseball card variation some photos were released before corrections were made.
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The speed of light is faster that the speed of sound that is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak. Trying is the first step towards failing, and failing is the first step towards success! Life's lessons cost money Some lessons cost a lot.. |
#5
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Lance,
What markings are on the back of the colorized photo?
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The speed of light is faster that the speed of sound that is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak. Trying is the first step towards failing, and failing is the first step towards success! Life's lessons cost money Some lessons cost a lot.. |
#6
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As far as a strict "Type" classification, that's something that is better left alone when looking at Burke photos, at least for the present. Reason being that as it stands, part of a "Type 1" designation is that 2-year window from when the photo was shot to when the print was produced. Since Burke continually produced prints from his negatives over the years, it's tough to definitively pin down a print date for most photos. There are some exceptions that I won't go into specifics here (for one reason, I'm still researching some aspects of the dating), but suffice it to say that I think for most of Burke's photos, a designation of "Original" is probably more appropriate and sufficient at this point.
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Ebay Store and Weekly Auctions Web Store with better selection and discounts Polite corrections for unidentified and misidentified photos appreciated. Rude corrections also appreciated, but less so. Last edited by thecatspajamas; 02-25-2014 at 09:59 AM. |
#7
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The back only had "Gehrig, Lou" penned at the top in Brace's usual hand (I say had, because I no longer have the photo, just the scans). That particular print was done by Brace at a later date for use in production of his Bra-Mac photo series, which were smaller "colorized" versions of Burke's photos of players from the 1930's. He used 8x10 prints, sometimes original Burkes from the 1930's, sometimes more modern restrikes, that were colored by hand by painting or colored pen, then re-shot them to produce the smaller 3x5 photos that he sold in groups of 24 over a period of several years.
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Ebay Store and Weekly Auctions Web Store with better selection and discounts Polite corrections for unidentified and misidentified photos appreciated. Rude corrections also appreciated, but less so. Last edited by thecatspajamas; 02-25-2014 at 10:23 AM. Reason: Grammatical |
#8
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The speed of light is faster that the speed of sound that is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak. Trying is the first step towards failing, and failing is the first step towards success! Life's lessons cost money Some lessons cost a lot.. |
#9
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(And he'll probably kick your butt if you suggest otherwise to his face ![]() This is what the final 3x5 Bra-Mac photo looked like: ![]()
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Ebay Store and Weekly Auctions Web Store with better selection and discounts Polite corrections for unidentified and misidentified photos appreciated. Rude corrections also appreciated, but less so. Last edited by thecatspajamas; 02-25-2014 at 10:34 AM. |
#10
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The speed of light is faster that the speed of sound that is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak. Trying is the first step towards failing, and failing is the first step towards success! Life's lessons cost money Some lessons cost a lot.. |
#11
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Since Im not as versed in how the photos were made maybe you can answer a question for me then. How come on mine and marks photo the corners are rounded in the photo and the paper. But yours and bens and the Bra Mack photos have square corners? Wouldnt that indicate the possiblity of another negative for the photo. And can another negative be made of the same photo? Just curious. I do believe ALL the photos shown are the real deal just that they were all made maybe at different times.
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The speed of light is faster that the speed of sound that is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak. Trying is the first step towards failing, and failing is the first step towards success! Life's lessons cost money Some lessons cost a lot.. |
#12
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As to whether he used certain stocks during certain periods, that is very difficult to tell since he did not date his prints, and is not something that I've looked into as yet. And when I refer to Burke's "reign" as photographer, I'm talking 1929 to 1948. Prior to 1929 he wasn't photographing ball players, and in 1948 he had a career-ending heart attack at which point he turned the business over to George Brace. Any photo with George Burke's stamp on the back would have been produced in that time frame.
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Ebay Store and Weekly Auctions Web Store with better selection and discounts Polite corrections for unidentified and misidentified photos appreciated. Rude corrections also appreciated, but less so. Last edited by thecatspajamas; 02-25-2014 at 10:56 AM. |
#13
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https://www.flickr.com/photos/bn2cardz/albums |
#14
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For those who don't know, the Burke at 847 Belmont Ave stamp is the stamp Burke used in the 1930s to early 40s. So on a George Burke DiMaggio or Ruth or whomever 1930s image, you want to look for that stamp/address. The stamp won't pinpoint a year, but is the old c. 1930s stamp. George Brace was his young assistant and later business partner who reprinted his images later-- with different stamp/address. Brace also was a baseball photographer in his own right and made his own photos. I believe Burke died in 1951 and Brace died more recently. A 'Burke & Brace' at different address or 'George Brace Photos' at different address stamp on a 1930s image will point to it being a later reprint, though I believe the Burke & Brace photos are still often old. On a more modern original photo by Brace of say Willie Mays or Mickey Mantle, Brace would stamp is own name and copyright 'George Brace.' It sounds a bit messy, because it is, but it's easy to remember that the Geo. Burke at Belmont Avenue Chicago are the vintage circa 1930s ones by Burke.
Anything with a Burke, Burke & Brace or Brace stamp will have been an 'official' photo, even if a reprint, as Burke & Brace were partners and Brace owned all the photos and negatives after Burke died. After Burke died, Brace was essentially a photo service, so his stamp on a reprint would be the equivalent of an AP stamp on a photo. In photography, an 'official' photo means it was made by a legitimate source with rights to make the photo, such as a news service, famous photographer's estate, Hollywood studio or Major League Baseball, as opposed to an unlicensed reprint by Joe Blow. If MGM re-issued Gone With The Win for theaters in 1979 and made new press photos to promote the new showings, the 1979 reprinted still images of Clark Gable and Vivien Leigh clearly won't have the value of the 1939 originals, but will still be collectible and have some value as they are official 're-issues' by the studio. For the record, Hollywood movie studio re-issue stills and press photos will have the studio's copyright text and date of re-issue somewhere on the photo, so aren't hard to identify both as re-issues and official. And, along the lines of Gone With The Wind, while clearly not nearly as valuable as Burke's originals, a Brace reprint is collectable and great for matting and framing with autographs. A collecting rule is don't invest in unofficial modern photographs, because they have no longterm value and are often illegal. If you unload your cache of unlicensed Richard Avedon reprints on eBay, his estate might sue you and block the sale. And, besides, digital reprints made on someone's home computer won't sell for much anyway. Last edited by drcy; 02-25-2014 at 12:32 PM. |
#15
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[I]"When you photograph people in colour you photograph their clothes. But when you photograph people in B&W, you photograph their souls." ~Ted Grant Www.weingartensvintage.com https://www.facebook.com/WeingartensVintage http://www.psacard.com/Articles/Arti...ben-weingarten ALWAYS BUYING BABE RUTH RED SOX TYPE 1 PHOTOGRAPHS--->To add to my collection Last edited by Forever Young; 02-25-2014 at 11:36 AM. |
#16
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The speed of light is faster that the speed of sound that is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak. Trying is the first step towards failing, and failing is the first step towards success! Life's lessons cost money Some lessons cost a lot.. |
#17
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For what it's worth, I checked Abebooks to see if Andy could find a cheap copy there, and it's not going to happen.
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$co++ Forre$+ |
#18
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For those who don't know, the Burke at 847 Belmont Ave stamp is the stamp Burke used in the 1930s to early 40s. So on a George Burke DiMaggio or Ruth or whomever 1930s photos, you want to look for that stamp. George Brace was his young assistant and later business partner who reprinted his images later-- with different stamp/address. Brace also was a photographer and made his own photos. I believe Burke died in 1951.
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