HOF expansion era ballot

[JimStinson]

Originally Posted by shelly

The only person the I feel belongs is Marvin Miller. He changed the game forever. The would not vote him in when he was around. Now that he has passed away I dont thing they have any choice but to vote him in.
Torre, was handed a team that anyone could have won with. His boss did nothing for baseball except to buy teams and make ball players earn more than they deserved. When his managers disagreed with him they where fired.Torre was perfect for him.

Agreed .....as did Curt Flood , both deserve but neither will go...Torre was a "yes" man and a Yankee ...he's IN
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[shelly]

Originally Posted by JimStinson

Agreed .....as did Curt Flood , both deserve but neither will go...Torre was a "yes" man and a Yankee ...he's IN
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Jim, agree that I should have mentioned Flood. I do belive Miller will get in. I also agree that Hodge's shouild have been in years ago.

[brewing]

Concepcion? Really? Different position, but Whitaker deserves way more consideration. I believe Whitaker is = to Sandberg.

Also, I rank Al Oliver above Garvey. Same OPS+ and higher career WAR. Garvey was featured in a bigger market with TV looks, that's his advantage.


As far as the managers, meh. I do believe Miller deserves it.

[perezfan]

Al Oliver is so underrated. Not sure he has HOF career numbers, but for a long stretch, there were few hitters that were any more clutch, or any better.

[JayZim13]

None of the players listed belong in the HOF. You can't talk about Wes Parker or Keith Hernandez if Gil Hodges isn't in the Hall.

[theshleps]

I don't understand why after someone is rejected for 15 years in a row, they should go to another committee and be looked at again. It seems after 15 years that should do it. They should actually shorten the 15 years to maybe 5. What makes someone more qualified his 15th year of voting than his 5th?

[mr2686]

Originally Posted by theshleps

I don't understand why after someone is rejected for 15 years in a row, they should go to another committee and be looked at again. It seems after 15 years that should do it. They should actually shorten the 15 years to maybe 5. What makes someone more qualified his 15th year of voting than his 5th?

I think it has more to do with the people voting and not if the player was actually worthy of enshrinement. I would have taken the vote away from the writers years ago. They are the dumbest bags of hair in the world.

[steve B]

This was mostly a response to Michael at post 40 it just took me a while to get it typed.


For a lot of reasons.

If a player doesn't get at least 5% in any eligible year they're off the ballot. So it's possible a player didn't get 5 years of eligibility. If for instance they were getting votes just short of being elected, then there was a very strong retirement group. Not a great example, but Dwight Evans had 5.9%, 10.4 %, and 3.6% what happened that last year? Ryan, Brett, Yount, and Fisk happened. It's possible Evans would have made it in eventually, maybe his 5th year. But he was removed from the ballot. His career numbers may seem unimpressive, but many are in the top 100 all time, a few in the top 50. Even after the steroid era his 385 HR are tenth for AL righthanders. Not too shabby for a borderline candidate.

For some players their impact may not be realized until much later. Some of these might more properly go in as contributors. Flood, Tommy John, probably others. Flood provided a player willing to take the risk that created free agency, Tommy John - Heck, the surgery that saves a few careers is named for him. Both had a larger impact than just what they did on the field.

And since the voting is done by the writers, there's a bias towards the guys who were more likable, or made for better stories. And towards NY and Boston players to some degree. Albert Belle is a prime example of a guy who did himself no favors. His numbers are pretty good, 381HR, .295 BA 1239 RBI and all that in what's more like ten and a half years. (And close to what Jim Rice did in 15 years, and it took them another 15 to elect him) But Belle was very abrasive, especially towards the press and only lasted 2 years on the ballot.

That's why it's good to give some players, as well as other contributors another look later on.

Steve B