HOF expansion era ballot

[shelly]

The only person the I feel belongs is Marvin Miller. He changed the game forever. The would not vote him in when he was around. Now that he has passed away I dont thing they have any choice but to vote him in.
Torre, was handed a team that anyone could have won with. His boss did nothing for baseball except to buy teams and make ball players earn more than they deserved. When his managers disagreed with him they where fired.Torre was perfect for him.

[JimStinson]

Originally Posted by shelly

The only person the I feel belongs is Marvin Miller. He changed the game forever. The would not vote him in when he was around. Now that he has passed away I dont thing they have any choice but to vote him in.
Torre, was handed a team that anyone could have won with. His boss did nothing for baseball except to buy teams and make ball players earn more than they deserved. When his managers disagreed with him they where fired.Torre was perfect for him.

Agreed .....as did Curt Flood , both deserve but neither will go...Torre was a "yes" man and a Yankee ...he's IN
___________________
jim@stinsonsports.com

Vintage autographs for sale daily on my web site
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[shelly]

Originally Posted by JimStinson

Agreed .....as did Curt Flood , both deserve but neither will go...Torre was a "yes" man and a Yankee ...he's IN
___________________
jim@stinsonsports.com

Vintage autographs for sale daily on my web site
stinsonsports.com

Jim, agree that I should have mentioned Flood. I do belive Miller will get in. I also agree that Hodge's shouild have been in years ago.

[brewing]

Concepcion? Really? Different position, but Whitaker deserves way more consideration. I believe Whitaker is = to Sandberg.

Also, I rank Al Oliver above Garvey. Same OPS+ and higher career WAR. Garvey was featured in a bigger market with TV looks, that's his advantage.


As far as the managers, meh. I do believe Miller deserves it.

[perezfan]

Al Oliver is so underrated. Not sure he has HOF career numbers, but for a long stretch, there were few hitters that were any more clutch, or any better.

[JayZim13]

None of the players listed belong in the HOF. You can't talk about Wes Parker or Keith Hernandez if Gil Hodges isn't in the Hall.

[theshleps]

I don't understand why after someone is rejected for 15 years in a row, they should go to another committee and be looked at again. It seems after 15 years that should do it. They should actually shorten the 15 years to maybe 5. What makes someone more qualified his 15th year of voting than his 5th?

[perezfan]

This will piss off lots of people, but I think LaRussa should get the same exact HOF consideration as McGuire, Canseco, Giambi and the gang. If you look closely (or even not so closely) at the list of illegal substance violators, you'll see that no two organizations are guiltier than LaRussa's A's and his Cardinal teams.

If highly suspicious steroid-era players are being snubbed, why should the Manager and Kingpin be any different? He was aware of exactly what was going on. Anyone who disputes this is kidding themselves. At worst he was instructing/pressuring his players to do the injections. At very best, he was "turning a blind eye".

I would put Gil Hodges in the HOF, but unfortunately he's nowhere to be found on the list

[glchen]

Originally Posted by perezfan

This will piss off lots of people, but I think LaRussa should get the same exact HOF consideration as McGuire, Canseco, Giambi and the gang. If you look closely (or even not so closely) at the list of illegal substance violators, you'll see that no two organizations are guiltier than LaRussa's A's and his Cardinal teams.

If highly suspicious steroid-era players are being snubbed, why should the Manager and Kingpin be any different? He was aware of exactly what was going on. Anyone who disputes this is kidding themselves. At worst he was instructing/pressuring his players to do the injections. At very best, he was "turning a blind eye".

I was just thinking about this also. If voters are going to keep the players out who did steroids, how about the managers (and owners) who knew that this was happening in the clubhouse and did nothing about it?

[earlywynnfan]

Originally Posted by glchen

I was just thinking about this also. If voters are going to keep the players out who did steroids, how about the managers (and owners) who knew that this was happening in the clubhouse and did nothing about it?

Well, let's remember: these are the same voters who also turned the blind eye!! Here in Cleveland, the main newspaper writer has written countless articles about how everybody is to blame for the whole steroids saga --including the fans!!-- but he never mentions himself. I read his columns faithfully through the 90's, and never once did he mention the ballooning beefcakes in the locker room.

The only piece I can ever remember reading about this in the 90's is when Rick Reilly chased Sammy Sosa around with the jar.

Ken

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by earlywynnfan

Well, let's remember: these are the same voters who also turned the blind eye!! Here in Cleveland, the main newspaper writer has written countless articles about how everybody is to blame for the whole steroids saga --including the fans!!-- but he never mentions himself. I read his columns faithfully through the 90's, and never once did he mention the ballooning beefcakes in the locker room.

+100
I'm not a supporter of steroid users in any way, but this is one of my main complaints with the entire issue. The writers completely ignored the problem because they had to kiss up to the players to get good stories and interviews and pay their bills. Now the same group of writers are coming out screaming about how sullied the game is and refusing to vote for guys. Even with all that in mind, I was able to forgive the guys who chose not to vote for proven users like Clemens, but when Biggio and Piazza were held "guilty by association" it really bothered me. Talk about a huge double standard. To me this was the last bad joke in the long, sad history of having the writers vote on HOFers.

[earlywynnfan]

Derek, very well put!!

Going back to the original topic, I'd like to see Torre and Cox get in, since I have memorabilia from them, plus I'd like to see Miller and Steinbrenner get in since I have extra auto's that I could sell.

Some may say I'm the pure combination of naked selfishness and blatant greed. My wife is a lucky lady!

Ken