Topps 1952 Campos..new variation

[ALR-bishop]

A few more

[flkersn]

Still interested in whether anyone else has a Campos with both top left border break AND partial black star (or complete black star).

[Zach Wheat]

Sorry my partial red star black star has a complete border.

As a set collector (ie read not master set) I take note of the variations and pick some up when I can - but my goal is complete when I have all of the cards in the set. The 1952 Topps set is a little different as the major variations (Sage/Pain, Campos red star, black star) are such an integral part of the set I am compelled to acquire those as well.

Interesting stuff though.

Z Wheat

[ALR-bishop]

You are forgiven Zach

[Zach Wheat]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

You are forgiven Zach

Thank you Grand Master Al.

Originally Posted by flkersn

Thanks for responding. As a master set collector, I am just trying to figure out how many variations of "regular/black star/partial black star/top frame break" there really are. I don't have many Campos cards, so I need help. So far I count five, not including variations of "blackness" on the black star and partial black star variations.

Bill

Bill,

It is interesting to note the H & S auction for the '52 Super Set included only 1 variation of the partial border break Campos card. However, we knew the Super Set listing wasn't complete.....just more complete than the standard listing. However, the collector did spend a significant amount of time and $$ collecting most of the known variations.

Z Wheat

[Exhibitman]

Not sure what I'm looking at/for with most of those cards shown above. Some are clearly printing errors, not variations, e.g., sloppy inking. Some are legitimately variations. I differentiate between the two as to whether there is evidence of a human intent in it. Like the 1969 Nettles RC with or without the loop. Someone had to go back and get rid of that loop. The same is true of the Campos star variations--someone had to go in there and repair the problem. I am not sure on the partial missing borderline as to whether I'd consider it a variation or a printing flub. The missing ink cards are definitely printing errors--desirable as such to the coterie of collectors who collect them--but are not variations from a master set perspective as I see it. Personally, I like the grotesque printing mistakes most of all.

[ALR-bishop]

Adam---while I collect variants of any kind my personal definition of a true variations is similar to yours, a card intentionally changed by the manufacturer. I think Bob Lemke had moved to that sort of definition as well and as a result removed some previously listed variations from the Standard Catalog, for example several of the border break listings.

But the Campos card and some of the other scans above show that no one definition fits all. I think the border break Campos is a print defect, but I think the black star may be as well. I say that because I have now seen several partial black stars. But the hobby certainly has given it the status of a true variation, as well as the Herrer and Bakep.


I posted the multiple scans above after the post above by Michael Wentz, who has the two Campos missing border cards up on ebay now, saying that he viewed both Campos cards as true variations along with any card in which there is a noticeable change in the structural elements of the card. Although my definition is more narrow, there is no recognized hobby wide definition that I am aware of. To each his own.

I was attempting to show in the above scans that no matter what definition one adopts, there will be grey areas, it is not black and white.

But I simply collect any variant, cards that differs for whatever reason, if it is interesting to me . Like your Zolio

[flkersn]

Originally Posted by Zach Wheat

Sorry my partial red star black star has a complete border.

As a set collector (ie read not master set) I take note of the variations and pick some up when I can - but my goal is complete when I have all of the cards in the set. The 1952 Topps set is a little different as the major variations (Sage/Pain, Campos red star, black star) are such an integral part of the set I am compelled to acquire those as well.

Interesting stuff though.

Z Wheat

Thanks for responding. As a master set collector, I am just trying to figure out how many variations of "regular/black star/partial black star/top frame break" there really are. I don't have many Campos cards, so I need help. So far I count five, not including variations of "blackness" on the black star and partial black star variations.

Bill

[ALR-bishop]

And I thought I was obsessive

Bill-what sets do you collect and what do you use to determine your "master" list for such sets ?