Getting sick of the more obvious frauds

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Bored5000

So much of the business model of many sellers on there now seems to be hope for a sucker to come along.

It amuses me as well to see a card, often times not even a particularly rare card, appear as a BIN at three or four times what it sold for at auction just a few weeks or months earlier.

This has been explained before, but I don't think anyone's listening.

But, again...."three or four times..." is excessive, but ebay policies are the reasons for most of the high BIN's, not sellers trying to find suckers. It used to be that a seller could purchase a collection based on ebay prices, then break it up on ebay with straight auctions. For a variety of reasons, that simply doesn't work any more. Yeah, yeah - I know about PWCC, Henry Yee and a few others, but I'm not going there.

The new business model is to either price an item at your bottom line BIN, or to price it much higher, with 'make an offer', which also results in the bottom line that you need in order to make a required profit.

And yes, there are ridiculous variations of the above that aren't effective and result in knowledgeable collectors getting upset, and we have all had times when we thought we had a very valuable item, but it turned out that the market didn't agree with us. We have also seen board members complain about a high-priced BIN on ebay, only to be told that the card really is worth close to the amount it's being offered at.

[glynparson]

Shole$$, When I sold I was considered rather cheap on my prices. I would always have dealers linign up at my table to buy. If I were to sell now I know you wouldnt buy from me. I simply dont need the money more than the cards and would list stuff for a high price because i honestly wouldnt really want to sell it.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by glynparson

Shole$$, When I sold I was considered rather cheap on my prices. I would always have dealers linign up at my table to buy. If I were to sell now I know you wouldnt buy from me. I simply dont need the money more than the cards and would list stuff for a high price because i honestly wouldnt really want to sell it.

Unfortunately it seems that is the MO of many large ebay sellers. It's getting more and more difficult to wade through their "any suckers today?" pricing models....

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by glynparson

Shole$$, When I sold I was considered rather cheap on my prices. I would always have dealers linign up at my table to buy. If I were to sell now I know you wouldnt buy from me. I simply dont need the money more than the cards and would list stuff for a high price because i honestly wouldnt really want to sell it.

You're absolutely right, I probably wouldn't buy from you as I and most educated buyers prefer sellers who really want to sell. But your situation does seem to be popping up more often lately. But as always, it's only a matter of time before sellers turn from "I guess I can sell" to "I REALLY need to sell" due to finances, health problems, family problems, doctor bills etc. That "dynamic" will always be part of the equation . I always say you just need to have the patience of a sniper, eventfully you'll get your mark.

[glynparson]

I'm more talking about setting up at a show which id do more to hang out with old friends than to sell. Just about anything except junk that I'd have out I'd want to probably replace or get something similar so I'd want to be able to rebuy item and make a couple bucks. I fail to see how that's looking for a sucker or trying to rip someone off?

[Matthew H]

Originally Posted by glynparson

I'm more talking about setting up at a show which id do more to hang out with old friends than to sell. Just about anything except junk that I'd have out I'd want to probably replace or get something similar so I'd want to be able to rebuy item and make a couple bucks. I fail to see how that's looking for a sucker or trying to rip someone off?

There is nothing wrong with making money, but there is something wrong with lying in the description of an item, that is "looking for a sucker".

[Matthew H]

Originally Posted by glynparson

Shole$$, When I sold I was considered rather cheap on my prices. I would always have dealers linign up at my table to buy. If I were to sell now I know you wouldnt buy from me. I simply dont need the money more than the cards and would list stuff for a high price because i honestly wouldnt really want to sell it.

What's the point of listing something if you don't want to sell it? That seems like a waste of time for you and others interested.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by Matthew H

What's the point of listing something if you don't want to sell it? That seems like a waste of time for you and others interested.

Matthew gets it! Exactly my biggest issue with certain "sellers" in this hobby. All they do is waste their time and everybody else's. Don't even list the card or contact buyers looking to buy....please just keep your cards for the time being if you truly have no interest in selling.

[wonkaticket]

There you go again Jeff getting bogged down in the details. What do you expect honesty and integrity, along with executives of auction houses not shilling and stealing millions from their clients?

[glynparson]

Is asking more than it sells for in auction unethical. Is Walmart unethical is bestbuy, or target , or whole foods, and every other single retailer in the country? Please give me a break.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by glynparson

Is asking more than it sells for in auction unethical. Is Walmart unethical is bestbuy, or target , or whole foods, and every other single retailer in the country? Please give me a break.

There's a big difference between asking for a little profit from what one paid vs. trying to bend over an unsuspecting buyer by asking 2-3 times what it's worth. Come on now. But again, anybody can ask whatever the hell they want for whatever the hell they own.....doesn't mean they're ever gonna see it

Also bad comparison, Bestbuy, Target and Walmart all compete with each other, so competive pricing will always rule the day.

[jlehma13]

After coming back to the hobby after years away like so many of you, I had to educate myself. I have been moderately successful with pick-ups and have had a lot of fun in the process because I have done my due diligence. Sure there are cards that I have made offers on that were declined, only to remain listed for months now. I had one issue with a seller that Ebay had to step in a rectify. Point being, I may shake my head in disbelief for a moment but, ultimately I pass on those sellers that are out of line in one way or another and don't lose a second of sleep over it.
Businesses close everyday. Putting the offenders, and there will always be offenders, on your list and moving on will speed that process up.

[bn2cardz]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

There you go again Jeff getting bogged down in the details. What do you expect honesty and integrity, along with executives of auction houses not shilling and stealing millions from their clients?

Millions? I have a hard time believing it could be more than $70k.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

Matthew gets it! Exactly my biggest issue with certain "sellers" in this hobby. All they do is waste their time and everybody else's. Don't even list the card or contact buyers looking to buy....please just keep your cards for the time being if you truly have no interest in selling.

He was referring specifically to card shows. Why attack him for that? Also, not everyone's life is focused on "your time". I don't even know you, but based on what I'm reading, I think I might actually enjoy the thought that I'm wasting some of your time.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by Runscott

He was referring specifically to card shows. Why attack him for that? Also, not everyone's life is focused on "your time". I don't even know you, but based on what I'm reading, I think I might actually enjoy the thought that I'm wasting some of your time.

And not everybody's life is focused on YOUR motives. If you don't like it move the f*ck along. Send me a PM if you're still having a hard time. And nobody is "attacking" anybody....yet.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

And not everybody's life is focused on YOUR motives. If you don't like it move the f*ck along. Send me a PM if you're still having a hard time. And nobody is "attacking" anybody....yet.

Settle down child. I have no desire to communicate with you by PM, or any other way. I was simply defending a legitimate board member who you attacked for no good reason.

Leon - is the playpen area ready yet?

[wonkaticket]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

Matthew gets it! Exactly my biggest issue with certain "sellers" in this hobby. All they do is waste their time and everybody else's. Don't even list the card or contact buyers looking to buy....please just keep your cards for the time being if you truly have no interest in selling.

Not looking to pick a fight here but there are two sides to every coin. Yes I agree some folks asking prices are up there. Especially when a card that is very publicly sold for say $2000 and then relisted for $10,000 on eBay. Sometimes I do see this and wonder why bother?

However not all offers are inline on the buying side either. Glenn example you contacted me about my VGEX Broad Leaf Tris Speaker asking if I would consider parting with it. Ultimately your offer price was lower than what I paid for the card two years ago.

I personally wasn’t offended or anything it’s all good. I only bring this up as an example. I can see how folks can get their feathers ruffled by what seem like insane offers be that buying or selling.

Cheers,

John

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

Not looking to pick a fight here but there are two sides to every coin. Yes I agree some peoples asking prices are up there. Especially when a card that is very publicly sold for say $2000 and then relisted for $10,000 on eBay. Sometimes I do see this and wonder why bother?

However not all offers are inline on they buying side either. Glenn example you contacted me about my VGEX Broad Leaf Tris Speaker asking if I would consider parting with it. Ultimately your offer price was lower than what I paid for the card two years ago.

I personally wasn’t offended or anything it’s all good. I only bring this up as an example. I can see how folks can get their feathers ruffled by what seem like insane offers be that buying or selling.

Cheers,

John

I'm glad you brought that up John, but you did fail to mention my last offer which was over $1,000 more than what you paid. But again it's irrelevant as we chose not to deal. You're a good guy John, I'm sure down the road we may come to an agreement.

[wonkaticket]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

I'm glad you brought that up John, but you did fail to mention my last offer which was over $1,000 more than what you paid. But again it's irrelevant as we chose not to deal. You're a good guy John, I'm sure down the road we may come to an agreement.

Glenn, that’s not entirely true and don’t appreciate the implication.

Happy to post the PM if you like.

I was trying to be nice and have a civil discussion on how folks can see things two different ways when it comes to offers.

If you are referring to the section in which after I tell you we are way off on a deal but thank you for reaching out, in which you counter with the “I may go $5500” and then explain how you don’t buy into fads etc. Then yes I guess you offered $800 dollars more. However the deal was done seeing as you weren’t close I didn’t take this as an offer and you know that.

My point Glenn is that as much as you can say why even list a card for sale if you’re not looking to sell? The same response can be on the other side of the fence from the seller saying why even reach out to me and offer to buy something if the offer isn’t going to be a serious offer.

As to tougher back HOF players being a fad that’s all in the eye of the collector and I guess the market will decided that should I decide to sell.

[Bored5000]

Originally Posted by Runscott

This has been explained before, but I don't think anyone's listening.

But, again...."three or four times..." is excessive, but ebay policies are the reasons for most of the high BIN's, not sellers trying to find suckers. It used to be that a seller could purchase a collection based on ebay prices, then break it up on ebay with straight auctions. For a variety of reasons, that simply doesn't work any more. Yeah, yeah - I know about PWCC, Henry Yee and a few others, but I'm not going there.

The new business model is to either price an item at your bottom line BIN, or to price it much higher, with 'make an offer', which also results in the bottom line that you need in order to make a required profit.

I understand the Ebay fee structure and the need to make a profit. I was talking about cards that will sit on Ebay forever because they are so far out of the ballpark that no one is ever going to come along and buy them.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Bored5000

I understand the Ebay fee structure and need to make a profit. I was talking about cards that will sit on Ebay forever because they are so far out of the ballpark that no one is ever going to come along and buy them.

Eventually I'm going to say something that really offends someone , but it's not intentional - I'm frustrated as much as anyone. On my end it's simply a problem of finding inventory at prices low enough that I can sell on ebay.