Casey Stengel and the 1909 Kansas City Red Sox

[bcbgcbrcb]

Great job, Scott and fantastic to have Dave's help as well. See, a little prodding from a fellow board member pushed you to unimaginable heights. Now if I can only wrestle that postcard away from you..........

[kdixon]

Here is an article I have that has some info on Stengel. It is kind of hard to read.

[h2oya311]

Scott - great investigative work!!!

[drc]

I saw the pc in person and thought it looked genuine.

As far as the newspaper clippings, I merely googled. That was the extent of my research. In fact there at the top of the google list, so I assumed Scott already read them.

But, yes, I take full credit.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by drc

I saw the pc in person and thought it looked genuine.

As far as the newspaper clippings, I merely googled. That was the extent of my research. In fact there at the top of the google list, so I assumed Scott already red them.

But, yes, I take full credit.

David, I googled every variety of "Casey Stengel 1910 post card Kansas City Red Sox" that I could think of, and I never saw those newspaper clippings - still can't locate them using Google. I thank you immensely.


Here's something from the 'George Cochran' page (by Craig Lammers) of the SABR Biography Project.

My Note: Apparently, Ira Bidwell, described as 'manager' on the reverse of the 1908 KC Bentons cabinet, was indeed also the manager of the KC Red Sox. This explains why there is so little information regarding the KC Red Sox - they only existed for one season:

"Ira Bidwell was just a few months older than Cochran. While still a teenager, he established the Kansas City Red Sox, an independent professional team. The Red Sox were competitive with minor league teams and even signed the occasional player under minor league contract. In the spring of 1910, Bidwell received an offer to move his team to Wyoming, and the Cheyenne Indians were formed. In 1910, pitcher Claude Hendrix jumped his contract with Salina of the Central Kansas League to play with Cheyenne. The next season George Cochran joined the team."

Here's a photo of Bidwell's 1910 team, from Photos of Bidwell's 1910 team



And from the same website (Bidwell standing):

[Runscott]

(not intentionally bumping this thread - just using it to save my research, which some may be interested in).

This website describes a different KC Red Sox, and has a postcard that appears to have a 1913 date inscribed on it. There is no mention of Stengel:



http://www.kchistory.org/cdm4/item_v...s&CISOPTR=1212

Based on this 1914 image, Ira Bidwell was also associated with the new Kansas City Red Sox team:

[Runscott]

I'm surprised I never read this, as I've read most of Creamer's books - fantastic baseball writer.

Here's an excerpt that talks about Stengel's semi-pro career, and his signing with the Kansas City Blues. The following picks up after a description of Stengel and his friends heading out in 1907 to look for work in the wheat fields, where they ended up playing baseball. I believe the 1908 references to the Red Sox actually refer to the Bentons, Bidwell's first team.

"Stengel's reputation as a ballplayer was growing. A year after the trip to the wheat fields he made another journey west [1908], this time with the Kansas City Red Sox, a slick semipro team (Casey always said "sam-eye pro"). A Central High student named Ira Bidwell had organized the tour, spending the spring writing letters and setting up a schedule. The team went as far west as Utah, playing local teams practically every day, but substituting basketball games in local YMCAs when it rained. The star of the Red Sox was a right-handed pitcher named Claude Hendrix from Olathe, Kansas, a few miles south of Kansas City. Hendrix, a little older than Stengel, followed Ivy Olson into professional ball a year or so later. He, too, would meet Stengel again.
The barnstorming trip with the Red Sox was Stengel's first introduction to the sometimes carefree, somewhat rowdy life of a professional, playing ball every day, chasing around for something to do at night. In 1908 much of their entertainment lay in horseplay, the callow humor that is still evident among baseball players and other athletes. In Stengel's time it was heavy with such subtleties as dumping buckets of water on unsuspecting people, putting snakes in teammates' beds, and so on. Dutch Stengel ate it up. The travel and the fun were major compensations for the players, who were paid only $1 a day, along with rooms and meals.
Despite this more overt venture into play-for-pay baseball, Stengel was back pitching for Central High again in the spring of 1909, his last year. He was the unquestioned star of the team.

... [description of Stengel's final year of baseball at Central High]

He went off again with the semipro Red Sox that summer, playing games as far east as St. Louis and out west again up into Wyoming and back. He was finishing his fourth year in high school that fall (he was a midyear student) when the local minor-league team, the Kansas City Blues, came after him. The Blues were in the American Association, the highest level of minor-league ball, just one step below the majors. In January 1910, Dutch completed four years in high school but lacked sufficient credits to graduate. He decided to chuck school and go with the Blues.
Because he was only nineteen, he needed parental approval. Breezily, he approached his father, contract in hand, and said, "Here, Pop, sign this, will you?"
"What is it?"
"It's a contract to play ball with the Blues. You have to sign it because I'm under twenty-one."
"What about school?"
"Ah, I'm finished with school. The Blues will pay me $135 a month."
That was a lot of money for a boy of nineteen.

[sb1]

I am sure David probably has one of the many newspaper search subscriptions available online. I use newspaperarchive.com