Are these variations or print defects?

[cammb]

Menke is a print defect.

[savedfrommyspokes]

Thanks guys for the info. Al, I figured that if you had not seen either of these cards as a variation, that the likelihood of them being a variation was slim.

The 61 card is tough to tell at what point in the process the black was added to the cap

Thanks again

[doug.goodman]

I would like to see a scan of the entire Dalrymple card.

Doug

[savedfrommyspokes]

Doug, here is an image of the entire card...please let me know what you think. Thanks

[JollyElm]

Are you sure that some kid didn't magic marker up that hat?? Or is it actually printed on the original card right from the factory?

[savedfrommyspokes]

I do not have the Clay D card in hand...in a different forum, I was discussing collecting variations with the owner when he shared with me these scans and OKd sharing them here. He tells me that the black on the hat appears to be part of the original printing process for this card, which would seemingly rule out the marker directly on the card itself. But again, I am also going by just the scans myself. Both Al and Doug seem to have infinite knowledge of these types of variations, so their opinions (as well as all others) are very welcomed.

[cubsfan-budman]

There are 45 1961 C.Dalrymple cards on eBay an none of them have that black hat.

[doug.goodman]

Originally Posted by savedfrommyspokes

Doug, here is an image of the entire card...please let me know what you think. Thanks

Thank you for posting the scan.

My main hesitation is that this is a very glaring variation to have been missed for 52 years by people like Al, Bob and Larry (my knowledge pales in comparison to theirs).

As an example, the 1963 variations that came to light in the last year or so, are tiny and some of them involve squinting. This does not change the fact that they are true variations, but it seems odd that when people are noticing variations that involve squinting, they were missing this huge black blob sitting on Clay's head.

I would like to hold the card in my hand.

And now I have something else to keep an eye out for on ebay, like there weren't enough things already.

Sitting on the fence,
Doug

[savedfrommyspokes]

Thanks Doug...not having seen the card (in hand) , and having some folks with much knowledge on the topic having no knowledge of this card, leaves me on the fence also. The owner of the card was provided with Bob's contact info via his blog, so it will be interesting to hear if he has indeed used that info to contact Bob about the card.

In regards to the 63s, do you happen to have a list of the variations you mentioned?

thanks

[JollyElm]

From my observations, here are the best ways to describe the cropping differences in the 1963 Topps cards. This is a quick cut and paste, so I didn't use the 'a' and 'b' to denote which is the tougher variant to find, only as a way to separate the two. Neither version is tough to find.

372 Lee:
a) Hat just about touches top border.
b) Larger space between hat and top border.

376 Wyatt:
a) Thickest of the red shoulder stripes is on his right shoulder. On back, vertical line next to "Year" is complete.
b) Thickest of the red shoulder stripes is on his left shoulder. On back, vertical line breaks at "1957-8."

386 Rookies:
a) Heads are very low inside the green circles.
b) Heads are well centered inside the green circles.

387 McBean:
a) On his right shoulder a speck of a second stripe shows.
b) On his right shoulder only one stripe is visible.

388 Davenport:
a) Shadow of collar just grazes red border. Mitt grazes border in green circle.
b) Shadow of collar doesn't reach red border. Mitt doesn't touch border.

404 Oldis:
a) Inset photo is centered, inner grey areas of the "8" on background jersey are clearly visible.
b) Inset photo is not centered, inner grey areas of the "8" on jersey are virtualy non-existent.

409 Face:
a) Small space between dark blue rectangle in the stands on the right and border.
b) Dark blue rectangle in stands on right touches border.

413 Walker:
a) No red stripe visible on left shoulder.
b) Red stripes are visible on both shoulders.

438 Stock:
a) Butt goes into border of inset photo. Inset photo head falls pretty centered between edge of neck and shirt stripe (of the main picture).
b) A little green is visible to the top left of his butt and head/hat brim falls under shirt stripe.

439 Zimmer:
a) Only 2 vertical shirt stripes clearly visible. Part of elbow not visible in inset photo.
b) 5 vertical shirt stripes clearly visible. Full elbow visible in inset photo.

445 Cash:
a) Ball in inset photo reaches border.
b) Ball in inset photo doesn't graze border.