The downfall of the PSA boards.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by triwak

The secret of 54???

SHHHHHH!!!! (Frank will kill me for giving away the answer!)

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Runscott

SHHHHHH!!!! (Frank will kill me for giving away the answer!)

Take off your shoes, Scott.

My hearing isn't all that good.

Feel free to share your secret on the other thread.

[eomint]

I do appreciate the need for an independent site such as this and that a forum exists for folks to share their views uncensored as long as they are not libelous of course.

In terms of my citing "great collectors" i probably should have worded it more carefully as there seems to be same 99%/1% divide on this board that is dividing the entire country. What I meant to say is that many of those who have arguably some of the rarest and most valuable stuff have entrusted their collection to PSA. That is a fact, not an opinion. That does not diminish in any way, however, the fact that there are a ton of of other passionate collectors out there who are great people.

I think it's pretty obvious that we all eventually die and cant take our cards with us and that material things are not the measure of an individual.

Love the debate, love free speech, dont love the feeling of hostility some (not all) convey.

Thanks,

EOMINT

[ALR-bishop]

I am currently debating whether or not to take my cards along with me.

[Matthew H]

Originally Posted by eomint

In terms of my citing "great collectors" i probably should have worded it more carefully as there seems to be same 99%/1% divide on this board that is dividing the entire country.

EOMINT

I think you need to look further than the PSA registry leader boards before you decide where the 1% is.

It's not really a debate. You simply don't know what you're talking about.
The people at the top of those "leader boards" are really just people that want to be hobby celebrities. They don't have the best stuff out there, that's a fact.

I personally don't hate people who have positioned themselves, in life, where the can amass spectacular collections. I feel lucky to know some people like that, and by knowing whats out there, I simply can't force myself to consider a bunch of "#1 Topps sets", or the "#1 T206 set" anything to call great. I know I sound like an ass, but I'm pretty sure buying high grade topps cards is a waste of money. People are paying wayyyy too high a premium for someones opinion on a card.

Matt Hall

[travrosty]

Originally Posted by Matthew H

I think you need to look further than the PSA registry leader boards before you decide where the 1% is.

It's not really a debate. You simply don't know what you're talking about.
The people at the top of those "leader boards" are really just people that want to be hobby celebrities. They don't have the best stuff out there, that's a fact.

I personally don't hate people who have positioned themselves, in life, where the can amass spectacular collections. I feel lucky to know some people like that, and by knowing whats out there, I simply can't force myself to consider a bunch of "#1 Topps sets", or the "#1 T206 set" anything to call great. I know I sound like an ass, but I'm pretty sure buying high grade topps cards is a waste of money. People are paying wayyyy too high a premium for someones opinion on a card.

Matt Hall

that's exactly right, there are tons of rare, great stuff, not in psa holders or with psa certs. tons of it.

the people on the top of the registry board just want to be celebrities, they want the pat on the back from psa. when psa holds their awards ceremony, there they are going up to accept the award of "best post 1930 but pre 1932 regional drum majorette set" psa 9.9 well whoop-de-do and so what? but they walk up there like they just won the nobel prize for chemistry. they shake joe orlando's hand like they just met elvis or something.

[CMIZ5290]

PSA does rule especially with resale value, no contest. T206 values are not even close between PSA and SGC. While I have alot graded by both companies, the values are not even close. Not trying to stick up for our newest member (eomint), but he is spot on pertaining PSA....

[murcerfan]

What I meant to say is that many of those who have arguably some of the rarest and most valuable stuff have entrusted their collection to PSA. That is a fact, not an opinion


like your 55 Clemente 10?

[CMIZ5290]

Another thing pertaining T206s, PSA is much stricter on grading than SGC. I have many SGC 84's and 86's that would never even cross to PSA 6 or 6.5's....Sorry, but it is what it is......

[vintagetoppsguy]

Nevermind

[HasselhoffsCheeseburger]

If the light is just right, and you squint hard enough, this thread somewhat resembles Han Solo.

[ALR-bishop]

This board, that board, any board, share what you know, appreciate what others contribute and do not take yourself so darn seriously...and welcome and appreciate newcomers

[Jay Wolt]

Al, well said!

[wonkaticket]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Another thing pertaining T206s, PSA is much stricter on grading than SGC. I have many SGC 84's and 86's that would never even cross to PSA 6 or 6.5's....Sorry, but it is what it is......

I need you to submit for me then Kevin.

I find the exact opposite I have many more PSA cards that won’t make the SGC cut for cross overs I have lots of PSA 6-7’s that when looked at had minor issues that when crossed went down grades.

Both companies are fine BTW I just think SGC is way tougher and I don’t think I would be alone in that stance.

In terms of returns I have confidence that my cards will get good values and that no major money is being left on the table crossing from PSA to SGC. I think quality items sell for quality prices regardless of what TPG they are in within reason of course.

[HRBAKER]

I have no dog in this debate but I think that the notion that the majority of high value and rare collections reside in anyone's plastic cases is pretty myopic.
Also not sure what the 99% and 1% divide is.

[tiger8mush]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

I have no dog in this debate but I think that the notion that the majority of high value and rare collections reside in anyone's plastic cases is pretty myopic.
Also not sure what the 99% and 1% divide is.

+1

[novakjr]

Yeah, I wasn't trying to bash anyone with my last post. Especially not PSA(although, I will admit that I don't necessarily agree with the poofing). I actually have plenty of respect for PSA, BGS and SGC. But they all have their flaws, and there shouldn't be anything wrong with pointing out those flaws.

Now, I believe there are some ill-intentions towards PSA being thrown around, but at the core of those ill-intentions there are still a few nuggets worthy of legitimate concern. Some choose to lash out, others choose to more calmly shed some light on the matter. It would be nice to not have to dig through intentions to find the truth, but it doesn't mean that we should ignore them alltogether.

Seriously, out of everything that's gone on PSA-wise in the past few weeks on the board, I think there are probably a few very legitimate concerns. And I will admit that with some digging, a few interesting things have been brought over. Like the P-P submission info with all the 10's.

As far as the newbies here, who seem to have only come here to vent. I think we need to look at that in perspective as well. We're being dropped right in the middle, without too much knowledge of how all of this may have been handled to begin with.. It's obvious that we're getting is the boil over, which may be a good thing. Because I've got to believe that it takes a person who is very passionate and serious about the hobby to let it get to that point. So a bit of harshness and short-sightedness should be expected at this point.. I expect all the newbies to eventually settle down, and let their passion lead to them becoming legitimate contributors to this board. And if we've gotta deal with a little mayhem in the meantime, it may be worth waiting it out.

[botn]

Originally Posted by eomint

What I meant to say is that many of those who have arguably some of the rarest and most valuable stuff have entrusted their collection to PSA. That is a fact, not an opinion.

There are some astounding collections in SGC holders and some that are not in any holders at all. Based on those collectors whose names you mentioned, I suspect by "rare" you are referring to PSA population figures for high grade (9s and 10s) cards. Others might define rare in a different manner.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by eomint

What I meant to say is that many of those who have arguably some of...

It's really impossible to argue with such a statement. What I mean is that it's arguably difficult for many of us to disagree with some of it.

[Deertick]

I look at the PSA refugees as I would taking in a stray dog: It may not have very good manners nor understanding of what's going on, but with a little training can be a valued member of the household. Or continue to poop wherever it pleases. One will get "attaboys", the other a trip to the "farm".

Jim Ma.rinari

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Deertick

I look at the PSA refugees as I would taking in a stray dog: It may not have very good manners nor understanding of what's going on, but with a little training can be a valued member of the household. Or continue to poop wherever it pleases. One will get "attaboys", the other a trip to the "farm".

Jim Ma.rinari

That's a good analogy.

Scott <=== off to find a burlap sack and some rocks

[lsutigers1973]

Originally Posted by Deertick

I look at the PSA refugees as I would taking in a stray dog: It may not have very good manners nor understanding of what's going on, but with a little training can be a valued member of the household. Or continue to poop wherever it pleases. One will get "attaboys", the other a trip to the "farm".

Jim Ma.rinari

Referring to intelligent grown men as stray dogs with no manners or intellect simply because they are disgruntled with the current status of the PSA board is not only condescending but extremely rude. If you love the hobby and this forum, one would think you would welcome new members instead of belittling them.

As for the difference in TPGs. In a perfect world we would have one TPG with a holder as durable as BGS, as classy and stylish as SGC with the resale value of PSA. Anyone that truly believes that PSA isn't the current market leader is fooling themselves or has their blinders on.

[ullmandds]

"As for the difference in TPGs. In a perfect world we would have one TPG with a holder as durable as BGS, as classy and stylish as SGC with the resale value of PSA. Anyone that truly believes that PSA isn't the current market leader is fooling themselves or has their blinders on. "

+1 But as for why PSA is still the market leader is beyond me...with their piss poor grading times/customer service...and inconsistent grading.

[lsutigers1973]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

+1 But as for why PSA is still the market leader is beyond me...with their piss poor grading times/customer service...and inconsistent grading.

Completely agree. No idea how PSA has survived this long with all the past "scandals" surrounding not only some high profile cards, but also recently with the pack grading. That doesn't even begin to scratch the surface of inconsistent grading especially when many cards increase in value by up to 50x's for a simple totally objective one grade bump.

[Matthew H]

Selling your collection for a premium through PSA = smart.

Buying your collection for a premium through PSA = ?

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by lsutigers1973

Referring to intelligent grown men as stray dogs with no manners or intellect simply because they are disgruntled with the current status of the PSA board is not only condescending but extremely rude. If you love the hobby and this forum, one would think you would welcome new members instead of belittling them.

Given their 'pooping in the house', I think his analogy was pretty good. You have created a very poor straw man - as you well know, our reaction to their posts wasn't because they are disgruntled with the current status of PSA. It was because of their poor behavior over here. Personally, I don't think the other forums do a very good job of potty-training their members - they simply drop them off in a field if they don't behave correctly. At least we are trying.

Loving the hobby and this forum have nothing to do with putting up with bad behavior. I've had my wrist slapped plenty of times - claiming that it was because a moderator "doesn't love the hobby or the forum" would be ludicrous.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Runscott

Given their 'pooping in the house', I think his analogy was pretty good. You have created a very poor straw man - as you well know, our reaction to their posts wasn't because they are disgruntled with the current status of PSA. It was because of their poor behavior over here. Personally, I don't think the other forums do a very good job of potty-training their members - they simply drop them off in a field if they don't behave correctly. At least we are trying.

Loving the hobby and this forum have nothing to do with putting up with bad behavior. I've had my wrist slapped plenty of times - claiming that it was because a moderator "doesn't love the hobby or the forum" would be ludicrous.

If not for Scott's comments on this thread I may have jumped out the window at the end of the first page. Please keep them coming.

[Deertick]

Originally Posted by lsutigers1973

Referring to intelligent grown men as stray dogs with no manners or intellect simply because they are disgruntled with the current status of the PSA board is not only condescending but extremely rude. If you love the hobby and this forum, one would think you would welcome new members instead of belittling them.

As for the difference in TPGs. In a perfect world we would have one TPG with a holder as durable as BGS, as classy and stylish as SGC with the resale value of PSA. Anyone that truly believes that PSA isn't the current market leader is fooling themselves or has their blinders on.

I read this board for months prior to registering. As a result, I am unaware of any time that I posted in the wrong category multiple times, called out longtime board members over perceived slights, denigrated solicited opinions, or pretend to have knowlege in areas I don't.

I was mainly referring to the the FACT that the lack of decorum that is prevalent on other boards and blogs on the interwebs, sometimes carries over to their participation here. There is a learning curve that most go through to outgrow the posturing and shouting which is necessary for survival on other boards. Most succeed, but some don't don't even try to get it.

Clearly, I was not calling new members "dogs". And "intelligent grown men" don't have hissy fits.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by Deertick

I read this board for months prior to registering. As a result, I am unaware of any time that I posted in the wrong category multiple times, called out longtime board members over perceived slights, denigrated solicited opinions, or pretend to have knowlege in areas I don't.

I was mainly referring to the the FACT that the lack of decorum that is prevalent on other boards and blogs on the interwebs, sometimes carries over to their participation here. There is a learning curve that most go through to outgrow the posturing and shouting which is necessary for survival on other boards. Most succeed, but some don't don't even try to get it.

Clearly, I was not calling new members "dogs". And "intelligent grown men" don't have hissy fits.

I have no idea what you just said.....Too many beers I guess....