A McCreachery Card Theory

[cyseymour]

Fascinating! Thank you so much for participating in this thread and enlightening me with your observations!

[Joe_G.]

I guess we left too much open to interpretation w.r.t. the McCreachery card. I was responsible for much of the content in the "Old Judge Production" chapter so I'll take the blame for not being more specific. To quote the book directly, as you did above, "The final example is a rare portrait card of Deacon White. A fictitous name, McCreachery, is listed together with the title of manager for the Indianapolis club. Deacon White, the oldest player in the league, was apparently better suited to manage from the bench than play third base for the Detroit Wolverines".

I did not intend to suggest his play was poor, but instead that his age (and appearance) was more appropriate for a manager than playing the hot corner. As for the name McCreachery, there could be an inside joke that has been long lost to time. I have enjoyed reading the posts between you and RcMcKenzie.

Thank You.

[cyseymour]

Joe,

Glad you have enjoyed reading the posts, and the OJ book was a definitely a huge contribution. However, I must say that I do believe the idea that the McCreachery card was a reference to his age was a misinterpretation. It happens - every book (and in fact, history itself) is an interpretation. That's why they say that history is always changing.

As for the idea of whether it was malicious, I have mulled it over and still think it might have been a mix - i.e., while it was a joke about his drinking, the producers of the cards may have realized it was malicious after a very short print run and then pulled the card. Which is why there is only one remaining specimen today.

Clearly, in a time period where Irishmen were seen as wild drinkers, hot-tempered and belonged to a poor, undereducated class subject to job discrimination, i.e., many signs for employment that read "Irish Need Not Apply", the card could be very well considered to be derogatory. White clearly had some very eccentric and uneducated ideas, and that could be the source of calling him Irish.

Whether it was malicious or purely as a spoof is subject to debate (we may never really know their true intentions) but White's strong performance on the field, plus the etymology of the name teasing him, strongly suggests that the joke on the card was not really a reference to his age.

[Joe_G.]

I'm not yet persuaded to see it your way but enjoy the conjecture.

I do have another request however, and that would be to change the title from "The Real Story of McCreachery" to "A McCreachery Card Theory".

[cyseymour]

Originally Posted by Joe_G.

I do have another request however, and that would be to change the title from "The Real Story of McCreachery" to "A McCreachery Card Theory".

Consider it done.

[Matthew H]

There's a lot of evidence pointing toward Joe'e theory. They used his only pose that showed his age and in street clothes, they switched him from player to manager, and Goodwin and Co had already issued other poses with humorous content, nothing malicious (unless you want to count Radbourn's middle finger).

It seems more likely that they got a stack of his photos from Fearnaught and thought that pose looked like the manager cards they were printing and made a joke. One interesting note is that the photographer was located in Indianapolis, I'm not sure what other connection Deacon White would have there, but I bet Joe would know.

The "creature" idea is pretty cool.

[RCMcKenzie]

His Christian, or given name, is James Laurie White. His parents and friends probably called him Jimmy, Jim, Jaime etc. Baseball players have a long-standing tradition of giving everyone a nickname. They called him "Deacon".

A Deacon in the Catholic church is a member of the congregation who is from the community. They are not formally trained like the priests, but they read from the bible and stand on the stage with the priests during the ceremony. Often, Deacons in a Catholic church are Bankers or Lawyers during the week and participate in the Mass on Sunday.

My thought is if they called him, "Deacon", they thought he was overly pious. And if he drank in his later years they may have called him McCreachery to make fun of his pious ways and beliefs (flat-earth) etc. At the same time, he was the manager and one of the winningest players of the era and so they respected him.

I am only speculating here, and preferred the title "story" to "theory" as I have very little fact to support my conjectures.

[kkkkandp]

My 1887 Pud Galvin card looks like it says "Calvin."

Do you think that was a subtle reference by the creators of Old Judge cards to theologian John Calvin, upon whose theories Presbyterianism was based? Furthermore, through that could it be a veiled reference to the Presbyterian cocktail as a subtle dig against the teams in the American Association - the upstart "Beer and Whiskey League" - that was challenging the teams from the more established National League? Galvin came from the American Association to the National League in 1887.

Just a thought.

[z28jd]

Kevin speaks the truth. It is well-known that the Goodwin family was an uppity bunch, always willing to take potshots at those they deemed less fortunate. They were also huge supporters of the French.

An example of their family's affinity for the French can be found subtly on the card of Frenchy Genins. The Goodwin's were still much maligned earlier in the 19th century for their ardent support of the French during the US-French battles at sea from 1798-1800(known as the Quasi-War). While the Old Judge cards didn't come out until generations later, their support was undying and unwavering. Being a company located near a huge US harbor, they were always welcoming towards their French allies during the 1887 time period. The Goodwins themselves were seafaring people and they owned a small island in the NY harbor, not far from their company. The spelling of "Genius" on the Frenchy Genins card was not an error nor a jab at the player. Rather it was a beckoning call towards the French to resume their attacks, intelligence at the time indicated that the defensive mentality of the U.S. towards the French was down due to the recent goodwill shown by gift of the Statue of Liberty in 1886.

Thus my friends, Frenchy Genius was a subtle nod to the French that times were right for war.

[novakjr]

Guys, don't poke the bear... He's likely to expand those statements into the extremest of levels, and then turn all of that into fact. Next thing you know he'll be referencing the OJ Checklist here http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=85245
and he'll notice that the first letter in the last names of each player listed for each team are A, G, M, S. Obviously, that's a jumble that spell out "mags". Clearly in reference to gun "magazines". Also noting that the first 4 players listed for Chicago are Anson, Hoover, Clark and Sprague, resulting in A, H, C, S. Clearly, in this code, the second letter is thrown out and the remaining letters are jumbled once again to spell out CSA or Confederate States of America. And that the first player listed for New York is Slattery, sounds pretty close to Slavery. Duh! It's so obvious now.. "CSA" combined with "MAGS" and the choice of using Slattery first, conclusively shows that they were supporters of the south, who trying to re-start the Civil War..

[cyseymour]

You know, it's great that we have a bunch of comedians on the board. You would have done well as Old Judge card producers.

I noticed the bit about Calvin and Galvin on my own as well as I was going through the C's and G's. It's clearly a double-entendre about galvanizing Calvinists.

It is all good and well to poke fun at me, I am not as serious as you think. I still think that the McCreachery riddle is very feasible. It would be wickedly clever if it were so.

As far as Cetzein, it sure would be cool if it were so. As I've calmed down from the excitement of the initial association, yeah... maybe as not likely.. but anything is possible!

For your viewing pleasure:

Yiddish: vet zein translates to "will be", likely that a corruption of cet zein. So using cet zein as a form of Socratic questioning is to learn what will be. Which is reasonable.

It's impossible to know the intentions of the OJ producers, but clearly cet zein is an expression, and it has been used as Getzien's name. So whether it was intentional or not will remain a mystery, but still very interesting!

[Joe_G.]

No such thing as "Cetzein" N172. Not worth posting twice, just check out cyseymours other thread: http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=160145

CySeymour, if you read my posts, my main objective was to correct your errors. I didn't attack your riddle. I think it is a bit silly, but I find it very interesting. I'd rate this as one of my favorite threads of 2012 despite the low blows. I like your enthusiasm for OJs, but you will find far more support if you simmer down a bit and avoid stating wild speculation as fact well before you've confirmed any of the facts. Hope to meet you in person some day, perhaps at a National.

To answer previous inquiries, some do believe the McCreachery card is really McGreachery. It is tough to tell. Lew Lipset catalogued the card as McGreachery. So what riddle is buried in McGreachery???

[cyseymour]

Joe,

With a "G", there would be no riddle in "McGreachery". If you go to post #87 you can see the reasons why I believe it to be McCreachery. But another reason is that I believe, among etymologists, the general rule of thumb is that if one is unsure between two different letters, and one of those letters creates a name or the root words of a name, while the other one is gibberish, then you go with the one that creates the root words of the name, as it is the most likely answer, seeing that it's a part of human language.

I'm still fairly confident that McCreachery was meant as a riddle. While, per the other thread, I realize that you are correct that "cetzein" was not, the McCreachery name does happen to be on a joke card and is derived from a fake, invented name, making a riddle much more likely.

As far as stating opinion as fact, I think it's just my writing style. I hadn't even considered it to be an issue, but I will try to be mindful of it in the future. I didn't mean to send you a lot of low blows, in fact, I hadn't realize I was. Sorry if you felt that way. Honestly, I felt that throughout the thread, you were consistently writing derogatory things.

But I have no reason to drum up the past and bring up old posts. Those are already done and finished. For the McCreachery card, still very possible it was a riddle, especially considering the context of the names and that the card possesses an invented name. As for Pretzel Getzien, it was interesting to learn a little German and the likely whereabouts of the Getzien family today.

I do plan to go to the National as well, and definitely hope to meet you. There is no doubt that you and your book co-authors have contributed a tremendous amount to the hobby. I also thank you for chiming in on this thread. As for me, I am someone who likes to challenge preconceived notions, even if I can't be right all the time. That's a standard which probably no one can live up to.

Cheers