How Far does the CU dictatorship go to silence whisleblowers?

Welcome to the board. If you do some searching here you will find many threads about those same issues. Just remember that Joe O does read this board so be careful of any slander. Even though it may be truthful you can still be liable. Kinda amazing what a lot of money will do for you huh.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Pup6913

Just remember that Joe O does read this board so be careful of any slander. Even though it may be truthful you can still be liable. Kinda amazing what a lot of money will do for you huh.

That's not true concerning libel. The truth is an absolute defense. That being said it can (and usually is) expensive to defend oneself even if you have done nothing wrong. And one other thing I should mention, after thinking a bit, I guess there could be a situation where someone bringing a false claim could be liable for legal fees of the other party? I ain't know lawyer (sic).

[smtjoy]

Welcome BigRedOne and yes there was a good thread over here about the Art Shell after it was deleted over on CU. We still never heard anything back from PSA about that card and the 6-7 other questionable cards that were all bumped by as you said a big submitter during the National.

[WhenItWasAHobby]

Originally Posted by Leon

That's not true concerning libel. The truth is an absolute defense. That being said it can (and usually is) expensive to defend oneself even if you have done nothing wrong. And one other thing I should mention, after thinking a bit, I guess there could be a situation where someone bringing a false claim could be liable for legal fees of the other party? I ain't know lawyer (sic).

Leon,

I'm not a lawyer either, but since you're a Texan like me, I do know a few things about Texas laws regarding libel. First, yes truth is an absolute defense and along with a fair comment on a public controversy. Both have been codified in Texas Civil P&R Code 73 . Second, you'll be happy to know in June 2011, Texas adopted an Anti-SLAPP law which can fend off frivolous harassment suits in their early stages and if you prevail, the other party is liable for your attorneys fees. Here's a link:

http://slappedintexas.com/primer/


As for the initial thread, yes I agree that PSA has some major problems as pointed out. The biggest problem in my opinion is that certain parties have been successfully aesthetically enhancing cards to increase their value and getting the cards graded into PSA holders. Sadly people are buying these cards with no knowledge of these alterations.

The big question that begs to be asked is how legitimate is a grading service when its nothing more than a means of facilitating the sale of altered cards for people who fail to disclose these alterations? At what point do regulatory agencies and law enforcement step in and challenge the grading companies to show that they are making some effort to offer the service they claim to provide?

[barrysloate]

Perhaps it is possible for a card in an 8 holder to be regraded a 10, but in the case of the Art Shell card in question it did not merit a 10 grade. Even from a scan there were minute flaws that could be easily detected with the naked eye.

So the issue isn't is it possible for an 8 to be regraded a 10, which I imagine in rare cases could happen, but why did that particular card receive a 10? That's the issue we've been debating.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

Perhaps it is possible for a card in an 8 holder to be regraded a 10, but in the case of the Art Shell card in question it did not merit a 10 grade. Even from a scan there were minute flaws that could be easily detected with the naked eye.

So the issue isn't is it possible for an 8 to be regraded a 10, which I imagine in rare cases could happen, but why did that particular card receive a 10? That's the issue we've been debating.

I understand Barry.....without going back and looking at that card I think I remember it being a weak 10, at best. But hey, anything above a 3 is high grade for me so don't count on me for this high grade debate. Here is one of the nicer "10"s I have!!

[jstef]

I'd rather own a card from the Lionel Carter collection anyday. In fact, IMO the Lionel Carter collection is the only collection that merits recognition.

[brob28]

Originally Posted by jstef

I'd rather own a card from the Lionel Carter collection anyday. In fact, IMO the Lionel Carter collection is the only collection that merits recognition.

+1 I'd add Jefferson Burdick to that short list.

[glchen]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

Perhaps it is possible for a card in an 8 holder to be regraded a 10, but in the case of the Art Shell card in question it did not merit a 10 grade. Even from a scan there were minute flaws that could be easily detected with the naked eye.

So the issue isn't is it possible for an 8 to be regraded a 10, which I imagine in rare cases could happen, but why did that particular card receive a 10? That's the issue we've been debating.

Weak 10's are possible for PSA because PSA does not have the Pristine grade that SGC and Beckett have. Therefore, weak 10's are Gem Mint, and strong 10's are Pristine.

For the Art Shell card in question, that's obviously a misgrade and does not deserve a 10.

[danmckee]

Originally Posted by Leon

That's not true concerning libel. The truth is an absolute defense. That being said it can (and usually is) expensive to defend oneself even if you have done nothing wrong. And one other thing I should mention, after thinking a bit, I guess there could be a situation where someone bringing a false claim could be liable for legal fees of the other party? I ain't know lawyer (sic).

I have trashed Joe Orlando on here many times and it is no secret that I hate his guts for making 6 months of my life miserable. Reference Mckee vs PSA.

But this thread is comical to me. All I can say is:

Welcome to 3rd party grading!

[doug.goodman]

Originally Posted by danmckee

...this thread is comical to me. All I can say is:

Welcome to 3rd party grading!

As has been mentioned to me recently, Dan and myself are "kindred spirits" when it comes to this issue. And this thread.

Doug