Fake Shoeless Joe Sporting News

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by nolemmings

Eric,

Near the top of the page, under the Grand Slam Bids banner you will see Vintage Links. Click there and then auction sites. Robert Edward Auctions and Goodwin would be good places to start, and for more obscure or 19th century material you may want to look at The Old Judge site. Many of these other auction sites offer good archived material too-- I just picked a couple that came to mind.

Todd,

I started looking into the archived auctions and found them to be a great resource. Thanks again for pointing them out to me.

Best,

Eric

[smtjoy]

I just put this together, the real ones next to the fakes so you can see a clear difference, thats why anyone who collects the set type can spot these bad fakes real fast, there are some other much harder to spot fakes were the only difference is slight cropping and no gloss on the front.

Here you go-

You can clearly see how much different the detail is, also look at the cropping of the photo of his feet/hands and the gap between the black border line-


The fake back is a mess and not even close to the real thing as you can see-


I did find the guide you had listed that the Shoeless was selling for 2.5 times the Thorpe back in 93, today the Thorpe sells for more.

[nolemmings]

Thanks for the scans Scott but everyone should remember that card #86 Joe Jackson does not exist with a TSN back, so your back scan came from somewhere else.

The back of this fake is just so obviously butchered that it is not worthy of scrutiny. However, since the front/back combo does not exist, this is akin to examining a T206 Wagner with a Sovereign 460 back with no frame, or better yet, a Soveriegn 460 back no frame, as they can't even get the text or the non-lettered art work right.

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by nolemmings

Thanks for the scans Scott but everyone should remember that card #86 Joe Jackson does not exist with a TSN back, so your back scan came from somewhere else.

The back of this fake is just so obviously butchered that it is not worthy of scrutiny. However, since the front/back combo does not exist, this is akin to examining a T206 Wagner with a Sovereign 460 back with no frame, or better yet, a Soveriegn 460 back no frame, as they can't even get the text or the non-lettered art work right.

Todd,

Thanks again, for everything. My hobby experience thus far has almost exclusively involved post-WWII material and I appreciate the information everyone here has been willing to provide.

Please know that your insight into the Jackson (which, I now understand, is not found with a Sporting News back) and the Hager book are tremendously well received. As I delve into a new segment of the hobby, I truly welcome and appreciate insight such as this.

Best Regards,

Eric

[smtjoy]

I hear ya Todd but anyone just looking at ebay listing and new to vintage is going to have no idea that front and back combo is not possible. I know its always best to learn about the issues before buying the cards. Considering I purchased a number of fake exhibits when I got back into collecting years ago I felt knowing what a real Sporting News back looks like can only help. The more you know on these old cards the better off you are. Knowledge is Good!

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by smtjoy

I just put this together, the real ones next to the fakes so you can see a clear difference, thats why anyone who collects the set type can spot these bad fakes real fast, there are some other much harder to spot fakes were the only difference is slight cropping and no gloss on the front.

Here you go-

You can clearly see how much different the detail is, also look at the cropping of the photo of his feet/hands and the gap between the black border line-


The fake back is a mess and not even close to the real thing as you can see-


I did find the guide you had listed that the Shoeless was selling for 2.5 times the Thorpe back in 93, today the Thorpe sells for more.

Scott,

Thank you very much for the scans. When the two Jackson fronts are placed side-by-side, the fake is quite simple to spot. In retrospect, it is now very easy for me to imagine how quickly an experienced collector would be able to see this from a mile away.

I also appreciate you taking the time to provide images of the Sporting News backs for comparison. I have never handled a card from that series; however, the fake does stand out like a sore thumb, even to me.

As for changes in pricing from '93 to present, I fully expected that would happen. My original intent when looking into collecting pre-war cards was to use the Hager book as a resource for identifying them. The thought of using it as a price guide, of course, would have been out of touch with reality. That said; I do find it fascinating that the relative values of the two cards (Jackson & Thorpe) have shifted so drastically.

Once again, thank you very much for your help. Please know that I do sincerely appreciate it.

Best Regards,

Eric