Now that all the lying is done...do you think clemens makes the hall?

[scooter729]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Boston fans twice counted out Clemens prematurely. First, after the 1996 season, when the team failed to sign him and Dan Duquette famously said that he was in the "twighlight of his career." Second, after the 1999 Fenway playoff game with the Yankees, when Clemens got shelled early and lost to Pedro. The press was giddy after that one, and with a 36 year old Clemens coming off a mediocre season, who could blame them? Of course he went on to win two more Cy Young awards.

Duquette may have been right - had Clemens not turned to steroids (which many believe started right around the time of leaving the Red Sox), it could have been the end of his career.

He had been right around .500 in the previous 3-4 years with Boston (something like 40-39 rings a bell), so to go from that to back-to-back Cy Youngs in your late 30s, sounds like there could have been some strong motivation. Or medical help.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Scott, recall that in the second half of 1996 he was pretty damn good, including a 20 strikeout game. I think it was more motivation than help.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Some of Nolan Ryan's best years were late in his career (in his fourties). Was he on steroids too?

[oldjudge]

Clemens, who was legendary for his workouts, won 61 games after age 40. That seems like a lot till you realize that Randy Johnson won 73, Warren Spahn and Cy Young won 75, Jamie Moyer won 105 and Phil Niekro, an obvious juicer, won 121.